American North
Until I read this, I had been disappointed that Thomas J. Sugrue’s Sweet Land of Liberty was ignoring the passage of civil rights legislation at the state level and the polling data that I had seen in other sources about changing White racial attitudes in the North after the Second World War:
“In America’s federal system, states and localities are often incubators of innovative public policy – and that was particularly true in the case of civil rights. Between 1945 and 1964, twenty-nine states outside the South enacted fair employment practice laws.
Sugrue focuses on New York, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania to show how the growth of the black electorate in Northern swing states during and after WW2 forced the Democrats and Republicans to compete for the black vote.
At the state level, the result was fair employment practice laws which outlawed racial discrimination in employment and subjected Northern employers to state oversight long before the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.
Re: ‘after the Second World War’:
Unjust GLOBAL WAR is said to be the watershed of this change, and all unjust wars depend on delusion and corruption and are followed by increased corruption — the opposite course of true religious revival.
Suppose we had refused to fight their war. How differently would things have turned out?
World War I had exactly the opposite effect.
It’s not so much war as it was a war against a “racist,” rightwing enemy like the Confederacy or Hitler’s Germany that stimulated the North’s egalitarian tradition.
It seems that every great movement toward racial equality has been spawned by a war that the nation perceived as a war for freedom.
The Revolution resulted in the abolition of slavery in the North.
The Civil War, other than resulting in the abolition of all slavery, also triggered the downfall of legal segregation in the North.
And, of course, the civil rights movement was triggered by World War II.
I think there are two factors behind this correlation:
1) Improvement in white attitudes toward blacks due to heroic black service in the military.
2) A realization that fighting for freedom and equal rights abroad is hypocritical unless those concepts are extended to oppressed minorities at home.
E.C. – I would say it was a combination of changing attitudes, based on a decline in the religious and cultural customs of a homogenous population, as well as on a desire by certain groups (the Frankfurt School, Freudian psychobabble, rise of ‘international bankers’ and Gramsci’s attack on the institutions) that caused much of the ‘sea change.’
But, HW, clearly the aggregate philosophy of the USA was ‘made ready’ in the decades prior to LBJ’s ‘Civil Wrongs’ legislation, rather than ‘at the stroke of a pen.’ Though, to my parents, the Civil Wrongs BS was seen as a communist plot at forcing compliance with HHH’s desire to bring the darkies up to MN, which we had not had, to that point. The idiot senator from MN practically emptied Gary, In of it’s entire populace, between 1965 and 1969, it seemed. And it’s all been downhill, ever since.
‘World War I had exactly the opposite effect’
The ‘roaring twenties’ following the ‘Great War’ showed the SAME general effect (moral corruption) of unjust war, though not involving any very marked change in racial attitudes, but still corruption — and the ‘permitting cause’ of the Great War was also the same as all the other unjust wars, for otherwise they could not happen.
Re: ‘(1) Improvement in white attitudes toward blacks due to heroic black service in the military’:
The Federal government drafts or hires all races and ethnicities from all states and regions, and even both sexes into its service.
‘(2) A realization that fighting for freedom and equal rights abroad is hypocritical unless those concepts are extended to oppressed minorities at home’:
Such as ‘making the world safe for democracy’ (Wilson used that slogan) so we need more democracy at home, etc.
Re: ‘the same permitting cause’:
I mean: apostasy and moral corruption, not the direct or immediate cause of any unjust war, but always related directly.
Very interesting article on the role of government- and Talmudically- assisted ‘pop culture’ http://www.alternet.org/black-pop-culture-tool-empire?paging=off¤t_page=1#bookmark discussing recent ‘SCANDAL’ and old ‘Jazz Diplomacy’: ‘Black Jazz Musicians were recruited by Eisenhower (…) at a time when America was only making slight overtures to crack the walls of Jim Crow Segregation’, etc. Music is a universal language?
I should have written: Music as a universal language?
Not all of us are susceptible to ‘appreciation’ and influence of alien sounds, or even of extra-ethnic white music. Some of us are quite ‘narrow’ in our taste.
EC,
(3) Cosmic delusion about the effects of living close by massive numbers of them.
The American reaction to WWI was the rejection of the League of Nations, normalcy, the restoration of isolationist foreign policy and restricting legal immigration.
WWII, the complete opposite.
I don’t think The Great War was the cause of anything good, but Christian revival, one wave occurring around the turn of the century in Britain and North America, causes other improvements. The moral decline of the twenties can be attributed to the war and other factors or causes.
“Some of us are quite ‘narrow’ in our taste.”
And just what are those “tastes?” Almost all current country and/or pop music has Negroid elements to it.
“one wave occurring around the turn of the century in Britain and North America”
There was no Third Great Awakening at the “the turn of the (20th) century” other than the founding of a few insane sects such as the Nazarenes, Pentecostalists aka “Holy Rollers,” and the criminal organization of Christian Scientists who kill young children by depriving them of proper medical care even today. It did result in Prohibition (surely a work of the Devil as it subsequently turned out.)
The much more widespread and profound Second Great Awakening peaked around 1840 and induced yet another outbreak of wacko Protestant schismatic cults such as the 7th Day Adventists, Mormons, Baptists, and Disciples of Christ.
You’re right, Rudel, about the Negroid elements in nearly all ‘popular’ music, popular at least with MOST whites (are you one of them?) — and about the history of ‘waves’ of appearance of new cults — but I don’t agree with the your position of the lack of any revival of Biblical and orthodox, true Christianity in recent centuries.
“(are you one of them?)”
You betcha! Unlike some of the supposed Southrons on this site I don’t consider Negroes “non-human. That’s because I have actually lived and worked around Negroes. We employed them both as domestic servants and at work. So have most of the Tidewater and Deep South residents I have known. I’m deeply suspicious of those here who deny Negroes their actual and demonstrable talents. The slave-owning aristocracy of the ante-bellum South sure made use of their talents.
They sho’ nuff can sing, dance, and cook. Many are big, strong, and fast, and you can get hard work from them if you manage them right. They may not produce many astro-physicists due to their generally low intelligence but they certainly got that rhythm. To wit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usain_Bolt
It doesn’t get any better than this:
And a sentimental favorite from my youth:
Another West African like Usain Bolt:
How can anyone deny Jimmy Ricks as the best bass singer in four part harmony?
Not to mention our beloved childhood cook from West Philly who could serve up all sorts of great Southern food. I’m made of cornbread, fried chicken, and red beans with rice!
Or “Mr. Prince”and “Mr. King” who did the occasional heavy work like clean and hang our winter storm windows. Our laundress was a bit of a sullen bitch though.
Lest there are any of you left who don’t assume I’m a nigger-loving scum-sucking Yankee, I much prefer this to the above selections as it is truly sublime:
The way I am, Rudel, none of that appeals to me, except the piece by Doc Watson, http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/30/arts/music/doc-watson-folk-musician-dies-at-89.html?_r=0 who was white by the way. We become what we eat, watch and listen to.
I didn’t see the Vivaldi when I posted my last comment.
@ “…The ‘roaring twenties’ following the ‘Great War’ showed the SAME general effect (moral corruption) of unjust war….”
There always has to be a “roaring twenties”— (“the 50s” whatever) to fatten up the proles for a generation and make them forget before they get shaved.
EC, the military blacks serving so well was a matter of propaganda (not that some non-white did not serve well)— but the whites who heard about this did not usually do so by word of mouth, but by rousing t.v. commercials on brand-spanking new t.v.’s, a mind-blowing technology.
And exactly what “freedom” was “fought for” abroad? Putting the protestant half of Germany (East Germany) under communist atheist rule for years, to wipe out their religion and split apart their families? Nice freedoms like that for the white relative of the u.s. (German non-catholic, non-jew being historically, with Scots and English, the absolute majority ethnicity of the u.s.?
The “freedom” for the Irish to have a nation, pushed in all the hollywood movies, not to mention by Harold Covington— (on this, “wn” and hollywood intersect, and hardly the only place, lol). The freedom in North Ireland, the Scotch-Irish, Ulster Scots (where half the american revolutionary army came from)— for “home rule” even as the political irish catholics like Kathleen Sebelius, our obamacare health secretary or (named endless more Biden, Fox news crew, alex jones crew, and so on) ensure the “latinzation of the u.s.”
A country where foreigners simply step in and start printing EVERYTHING in a foreign language they like (latin, i.e., spanish).
That Freedom? Try going to China and simply printing everything in Japanese. Trying going to Nigeria and printing everything in Chinese.
Oh— and then get ROBOTS to call up people on the telephones they pay for, to do marketing in Chinese, for Chinese products in Nigeria.
Wracking my brain for this “freedom” being discussed.
Idk anyone who thinks of mormons as protestants. Usually they are not so, and were run all the way out to Utah.
Besides which, most look and smell catholic (or were raised that way, like the drunk Glen Beck, I thought). Romney with his serious “south american” leanings, family, etc. Reagan would have made a good one.
“The way I am, Rudel, none of that appeals to me, except the piece by Doc Watson”
I love Doc too and was lucky enough to see him perform several times. He was however singing about a black man in that song.
Everybody was raised on black music. That’s what the u.s. provides to “the masses.” Just like stadium-arean circus style football.
So OF COURSE, people will have “fond memories” of some dance where they were having a good time, where it was played, their first kiss to some such, and so on.
But you can’t confuse YOUR CHILDHOOD MEMORIES of the full context of what you were experiencing with a love of that music. (or whatever.)
IT’s like people confusing things and hanging on bitterly to the Religion they were raised in, simply b/c they had a nice time in youth group, or felt like a little princess in a confirmation dress, or made out with so and so in the churchyard, or were treated kindly by some cute priest when their parents were breaking up, and so on.
You just can’t confuse those things.
And the question is there: what would life have been WITHOUT this or that influence. The “life unlived” and all that.
“German non-catholic, non-jew being historically, with Scots and English, the absolute majority ethnicity of the u.s.?”
That’s certainly an arbitrary melange of ethnicities to be declared a single “ethnicity.” One could come up with another “majority” by lumping together a bunch of other groups too. BTW, there aren’t really all that many Scots in the U.S. You must have meant Scotch-Irish who are a melange of Scotii (an Irish Gaelic tribe who invaded the land of the Picts after the Romans left), and the mixed ethnicity English Borderers, all driven from their land and forcibly exported to Northern Ireland, Australia, or Virginia and Pennsylvania as convicts and indentured servants by a bunch of English aristos.
Did I read you actually went to Catholic school? The nuns must have warped your mind.
“what would life have been WITHOUT this”
Squaresville, I reckon.
“They sho’ nuff can sing, dance, and cook. Many are big, strong, and fast, and you can get hard work from them if you manage them right. They may not produce many astro-physicists due to their generally low intelligence but they certainly got that rhythm. ”
Then,Rudel, it’s not a difference of opinion, but only a matter of degree.
I don’t deny them their NEGRO homidhood, I merely deny them ontological equality with MY White Humanity. There IS a difference, and I think you have been protesting too much against those of us (such as Denise, possibly Mosin, and myself) who don’t see this as much different than your statement above. But to have them live with us, when the weight of history, and modern political demagoguery uses them as a wedge/tool/xenos to destroy US, and OUR culture… well, then, I’d rather dehumanize the entire lot, than have them stay with us. I hear Liberia is looking for their ‘lost kings and queens.’ Why not ship the over 50% of EBT users in the Negroid population BACK to Africa, and ‘decrease the surplus population,’ as Scrooge says in Dickens?
Unless you want darkies around to remind you of your superiority? Frankly, I don’t need that reason to keep the Nigs. I just look at the products of public school education for that…..white or Black. You know? The People who voted Obama in… twice!? There’s an IQ deficiency on parade, that one is…….
“Did I read you actually went to Catholic school? The nuns must have warped your mind.”
Rudel, they usually do. And the nuns prior to Vatican II, actually made better US citizens than all the Head Starts since then…..
Re: E C
Here’s a book you will enjoy:
http://www.amazon.com/The-Unsteady-March-Decline-Equality/dp/0226443418
Re: Mosin
Woodrow Wilson resegregated the federal government for the first time since the Lincoln administration. The Second Klan, the Immigration Act of 1924, Garvey’s Back to Africa movement, eugenic sterilization laws, the Virginia Racial Integrity Act, race riots and lynchings followed World War I.
The federal anti-lynching bill was also introduced and killed on multiple occasions in Congress. Illegal aliens from Mexico were deported during the Hoover administration. Hoover also wanted to create a “lily-White” Republican Party.
The 1920s and early 1930s were on balance a period of retrenchment and marginalization for the “civil rights” movement.
Right, Hunter. I understood all that. But somehow the war had its corrupting effect. Of course I don’t think you were crediting the war for the period of retrenchment.
“Unless you want darkies around to remind you of your superiority?”
There aren’t any darkies around in Oregon unless you go to North Portland. I don’t believe the climate at all suits them.
Rudel says:
‘How can anyone deny Jimmy Ricks as the best bass singer in four part harmony?’.
Negro bass singers are not impressive, in my opinion.
But then, I am not a fan of the fuzzy, scratchy, gravelly, diffused, dampened tone so many of them produce.
They do not have the depth, clarity, timbre and penetrating TONE of Whites. Listen to gospel quartets featured on the Bill Gaither videos.
J.D. Sumner in his prime makes Ricks sound like a high tenor. Tim O’Brien of Gold City has a metallic quality that cannot be duplicated by blacks.
Listen to the country-pop song ‘Elvira’ by the Oakridge Boys and pay attention to the
bass line sung by Richard Sterban.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVHQsmIaDBY
Same thing with tenors. The voices of greats such as Franco Corelli, Pavarroti and the incredible Mario Lanza and dozens more are simply not found among blacks.
Richard Lewis singing Handel is one of my long favourites, and nearly all other Welsh singers in the native tongue. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7DXssuBNck&list=PLX1eMlEja5wjsOKzKyDMxnOcFGqP7zuE0
Handel is the bridge of the Germanic to the British, and suits the voice of Lewis well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34r4a1O3McI
No jungle syncopation or ‘blue’ dissonance at all.
One more example:
Perhaps the perfect musical combination of Welsh hymn, Cymraeg (‘the language of heaven’), the organ and church sanctuary acoustics, and voice of masculine white youth not comparable to Michael Jackson: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2wbHdDvPgo
ENTIRELY unlike Michael Jackson, this young Anglo-Celtic man http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmVdNoy5g3g sings one of my favourites by John Dowland (perhaps the greatest English composer and lutenist of all time, who resisted a lucrative offer from the Papacy to commit treason). Music might be a universal language for some, but for us it is our own narrow ethnic and religious ‘language’.
“Listen to the country-pop song ‘Elvira’ by the Oakridge Boys and pay attention to the bass line sung by Richard Sterban.”
Elvira? Sorry I’m just not hearing it when he sings.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu_wW4OJwjY
J.D. Sumner gets low but definitely goes a little flat on a few notes.
Good, Rudel. The mature white bass voice contrasts well with the sopranos of youth. African music is like an intoxicant, white music like healthy natural food.
“African music is like an intoxicant, white music like healthy natural food.”
It’s amazing how you make stuff like this up. Absolutely ludicrous. Here is some 150 proof bathtub gin for ya’.
Rudel says:
‘J.D. Sumner gets low but definitely goes a little flat on a few notes.’
I’ll have to listen more closely. If he did I’ll give him a pass considering he was no spring chicken at that time and was performing live.
When I mentioned the -metallic- sound I was referring to Tim Riley, not O’Brien. Got my Irish names mixed up.
Listen at the 1:49 and also the 2:49 marks for excellent examples.
Never heard a negro approaching anything near that.