About Hunter Wallace 12392 Articles
Founder and Editor-in-Chief of Occidental Dissent

20 Comments

  1. If anyone comes here to denounce PEGIDA, then they are a huge part of the problems. All these anonymous internet posters who claim everything is not radical enough or not quite suitable to their standard in some way, are people who will never do anything.

    There are saying, “I’m too scared to make a stand, so I’m going to insult everyone else who is making a stand.”

  3. Interminable arguments in cyberspace. Low trust, paranoia, and conspiracy theories. Venting on the internet under anonymous pseudonyms. Vicious infighting over history, religion, or pet abstractions. Total disorganization. Such is the state of the movement in the United States.

    For a year and a half, we have tried to move away from that and get people to focus on the problem at hand – mass Third World immigration and cultural and demographic displacement- by taking action in the streets. Obviously, I don’t agree with PEGIDA on every point, but I do believe that mass demonstrations like this can galvanize the movement.

  5. Last time this came up, I mentioned I found myself convinced by this writer’s reasoning. I’ve not seen these arguments rebutted anywhere, though of course reasonable people can disagree on whether that’s true or even matters.

    While I’m a little reluctant to be the prototypical, pseudo-anonymous, stereotypical, nay-saying jerk who checks in just to throw ice water on what might be an encouraging development in Germany, I have to ask: what’s the difference in principle between PEGIDA and the Tea Party? I don’t think that’s an unreasonable question, nor an implied “denunciation” of PEGIDA.

  7. Like I said above, I know I am wasting my breath.

    For the last 15 years, the movement in the US has been stuck in this internet gutter. The people who do support us are afraid of losing their jobs if they speak out, so they look out for themselves, don’t join/participate in anything, and confine their activities to venting and fighting with each other in cyberspace.

    As for those who do stand up, they don’t have the resources (the money, the manpower) to accomplish any of their goals, which depresses their effectiveness and appeal to their target audience. Those who do stand up eventually conclude that they are throwing away their own lives on a thankless task for a doomed people who don’t care. They make their exit through the revolving door and the cycle repeats itself whenever some new individual steps up to give it their shot.

    If you want to be philosophical about it (and lots of people do), the root of the problem is fear and extreme individualism. It’s like being in a hostage situation where the hostages have the numbers to overwhelm their captors, but fear and individualism prevents them from taking any coordinated action to liberate themselves.

    As for how this relates to the PEGIDA movement in Germany, it is important to remember that they are operating in the most oppressed country in Europe with insane anti-racism laws that prevents them from organizing along more explicit lines. The important thing is that so many people have overcome their individual fear of being demonized/marginalized/prosecuted as “racists” – please note, their critics in the US have yet to do so, and they don’t have to worry about being thrown in prison – and have begun to publicly stand up for themselves and demand changes to their immigration laws.

    It’s far easier for a snowballing movement like this one to radicalize as it gains strength than it is for a stagnant and completely marginalized one like the one we have in the United States to get two feet off the ground.

  9. What’s the difference in principle between PEGIDA and the Tea Party?

    Maybe the difference is that the Tea Party is deeply entangled and entrenched within the political division (Left-Right / Dem-Gop) of America. The Tea Party is part of the corrupt political system.

    PEGIDA has no such affiliation or dependence yet. Not one of the established parties in Germany supports the movement. It burst onto the scene so fast that the regime had no time to “canalise” the movement, that is, PEGIDA has not been bought, infiltrated, or “systemised”. This is exactly why the establishment went into panic mode. They thought they could shut themselves off and mobilise their media machine to whack PEGIDA with the Nazi hammer. But the strategy failed because the crowd is NOT Nazi at all, they are middle-class, and they keep coming to the rallies.

    The case for multiculturalism is much weaker in Germany than the US. Where are the arguments for importing Muslims when they slaughter our people? The Merkel regime has zero credibility on this issue now. People are outraged at her statement that “Islam belongs to Germany”. Multiculturalism with Muslims is not working at all, everybody knows it, there are hundreds of no-go zones in Paris and the terror attacks were the last straw that broke the camel jockey’s back. People don’t want a “French situation” in Germany.

    I don’t have high hopes or expectations for PEGIDA, though. The regime will finally approach the movement, deals will be made, PEGIDA will be politicised and compromised. At best, the illegal asylum seekers and radical Muslims will be kicked out of Germany and pandering to Muslims will be reduced. But the resident Turks will stay and multiply. Ethnic Germans have a birthrate of 1.0. Do the math!

  10. Chris from Germany

    In the short term, if I was a PEGIDA leader, my biggest fear wouldn’t be the left wing, wouldn’t be “antifa,” wouldn’t be government attempts to ban it, wouldn’t be the hate speech police. It would be the lamestream conservatives trying to co-opt it, harvest its political energy, then flying it into the ground once the lamer cons have won enough elections.

  13. If 40,000 people stopped marching against islamism but became active on the internet on anti-immigration blogs, I think they would have some political influence too.

  14. Nope.

    15 years and millions of comments on vBulletin forums, Twitter, Facebook and blogs show otherwise. No one who refuses to stand behind their own words in public will ever be taken seriously.

  15. Therein lies the problem. What good does it do to expose myself publicly and get fired for speaking what we as realists know is the truth?

    Each one of us has to pick our own “hill to die on” so the saying goes. Sacrificing myself on the alter of political correctness just isn’t appealing to me right now. After the kids are raised I may find I have a strong desire to water the tree of Liberty, who knows. In the meantime, I’m raising my children to be independent, critical thinkers and to earn a living “off the grid” if at all possible. I don’t want to sound defeatist, but until the situation gets much worse, people simply aren’t going to turn off the TV, get off Facebook and rise up like they did in Tulsa in 1921. I am open to suggestion & I support what you are doing HW.

  16. I don’t think there are all that many blogs and forums speaking up against immigration. But there is also a terrible lack of organization. It is true that having 40 000 similar blogs saying more or less the same thing would not necessarily improve the situation a lot.

    If the WN had some money, it could be used to promote cooperation, to organize common work, to try and find out what kind of information is missing, to assign some particular work to some people, and so on.

    If a White Nationalist wants to have an influence, he can start a new blog, use his brains to create interesting content, and keep working at it every day.

    But I’d like to see people try a different approach and work as middlemen to promote cooperation between different WN websites. I’m sure that some people would be good at doing that. The internet WN sphere needs to create centralizing structures. I can imagine three WN blogs getting together, and then, fusing with other similar blogs, and becoming a bigger and bigger structure all the time, swallowing everything…
    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094761/

  17. Why do you have to be angry to march? Why not start a Southern Stroll and do a regular walk whether you’re angry or not.

  19. Related: Marine Le Pen in The New York Times. She sounds like a Republican to me. Le Pen uses liberal appeals, supports assimilation and, by implication, a civic or propositional identity for the French, and claims the problem is Islamic fundamentalism rather than Islam itself. Her main policy ideas are: ending unlimited movement across EU nations, immigration restrictions, and extricating France from the various quagmires in the Middle East created by Americans.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/19/opinion/marine-le-pen-france-was-attacked-by-islamic-fundamentalism.html?_r=1

Comments are closed.