Robert Lindsay, Again

Robert Lindsay is on a tear this morning against White Nationalism. I’m starting to think he does this to reflexively reassert his leftist bonafides. For some reason, Lindsay feels compelled to convince himself he is still a leftist, even as he continues to wander farther off the plantation into uncharted territory. Leftists don’t cotton to race realism, honest discussions about Jewish influence, White advocates and so on. Their implacable hostility to Lindsay makes that clear.

The canard that White Nationalists are “White Supremacists” can easily be dealt with. A hundred years ago, the typical White Supremacist believed in a vertical hierarchy of races. He didn’t object to living amongst “darkies” provided they were kept in their place. In the Jim Crow South, there was a strong sense of paternalism; White men talked fondly of “their negroes” as if they were their own wards or children. This is not at all the world that 21st century White Nationalists wish to return to. William Pierce wasn’t William Lowndes Yancey.

White Nationalism has a long pedigree in America. In the nineteenth century, it was derided as “free soilism” by the real White Supremacists who supported the expansion of slavery. The roots of White Nationalism can be traced back to the Borderland that separated North and South. In this region, there was always a strong sentiment amongst common whites that the separatism which threatened to destroy the Union would disappear if the negro could be deported to some faraway land.

White Nationalists and White Supremacists clashed repeatedly over slavery, immigration, internal improvements, the tariff, Catholicism, federalism, interpretation of the Constitution, and a number of other issues. The distinction between the two has been lost in mainstream discourse only because America has moved so far to the left on racial issues. Today, the Klan is lumped in with Neo-Nazis, even though the original Ku Klux were inveterate enemies of national consolidation.

White Nationalists aren’t proposing anything more radical than a Japan for Whites. The Japanese seem to be getting ahead in the world without resorting to apartheid, expulsion or extermination. Racial separatism is infinitely preferable to a slow descent into the Third World, a fate which Lindsay says he wouldn’t wish on anyone, but is ideologically resigned to.

About Hunter Wallace 12325 Articles
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50 Comments

  1. Silver, I’m not interested in arguing with you, as you’re too far removed from my sensibilities.

    That’s not true. Our sensibilities are quite similar.

    * I’m an atheist. I do value and pursue the spiritual experience and am open to religious “possibilities” but I’m not troubled by atheism nor do I object to being called one.

    * I’m a eugenicist. It’s the method and the justification for it we differ on, not the value or necessity of it.

    * I’m not opposed to nordicism; historically, culturally and racially it is eminently sensible and defensible. I’d happily separate from you; it’s just a matter of convincing others to do the same.

    The greatest difference is I don’t loath others; I genuinely appreciate them, even if I do consider it necessary, or at least a good idea, to separate. You miss out on too much of life by unnecessarily clamming up the way you do; pragmatically, it makes you a less effective advocate for your cause. Lighten up.

  2. 38Robert Lindsay
    “No, I am pure White (except I am related to Pocohontas) but that’s way less than 1% Amerindian and won’t even show up in a genetic test as it’s all been washed out by now. Beyond that, there’s no Black, Mestizo, Asian, anything. It’s all White. ”
    My DNA revealed 1/18,000 trace of Ashkenazi, that is a lot further back than Pocahontas. Probably a rape victim.

  3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTW0y6kazWM&feature=player_embedded

    We Can’t Make It Here Anymore

    – by James Mcmurtry

    Lyrics

    Vietnam Vet with a cardboard sign
    Sitting there by the left turn line
    Flag on the wheelchair flapping in the breeze
    One leg missing, both hands free
    No one’s paying much mind to him
    The V.A. budget’s stretched so thin
    And there’s more comin’ home from the Mideast war
    We can’t make it here anymore

    That big ol’ building was the textile mill
    It fed our kids and it paid our bills
    But they turned us out and they closed the doors
    We can’t make it here anymore

    See all those pallets piled up on the loading dock
    They’re just gonna set there till they rot
    ‘Cause there’s nothing to ship, nothing to pack
    Just busted concrete and rusted tracks
    Empty storefronts around the square
    There’s a needle in the gutter and glass everywhere
    You don’t come down here ‘less you’re looking to score
    We can’t make it here anymore

    The bar’s still open but man it’s slow
    The tip jar’s light and the register’s low
    The bartender don’t have much to say
    The regular crowd gets thinner each day

    Some have maxed out all their credit cards
    Some are working two jobs and living in cars
    Minimum wage won’t pay for a roof, won’t pay for a drink
    If you gotta have proof just try it yourself Mr. CEO
    See how far 5.15 an hour will go
    Take a part time job at one of your stores
    Bet you can’t make it here anymore

    High school girl with a bourgeois dream
    Just like the pictures in the magazine
    She found on the floor of the laundromat
    A woman with kids can forget all that
    If she comes up pregnant what’ll she do
    Forget the career, forget about school
    Can she live on faith? live on hope?
    High on Jesus or hooked on dope
    When it’s way too late to just say no
    You can’t make it here anymore

    Now I’m stocking shirts in the Wal-Mart store
    Just like the ones we made before
    ‘Cept this one came from Singapore
    I guess we can’t make it here anymore

    Should I hate a people for the shade of their skin
    Or the shape of their eyes or the shape I’m in
    Should I hate ’em for having our jobs today
    No I hate the men sent the jobs away
    I can see them all now, they haunt my dreams
    All lily white and squeaky clean
    They’ve never known want, they’ll never know need
    Their sh@# don’t stink and their kids won’t bleed
    Their kids won’t bleed in the da$% little war
    And we can’t make it here anymore

    Will work for food
    Will die for oil
    Will kill for power and to us the spoils
    The billionaires get to pay less tax
    The working poor get to fall through the cracks
    Let ’em eat jellybeans let ’em eat cake
    Let ’em eat sh$%, whatever it takes
    They can join the Air Force, or join the Corps
    If they can’t make it here anymore

    And that’s how it is
    That’s what we got
    If the president wants to admit it or not
    You can read it in the paper
    Read it on the wall
    Hear it on the wind
    If you’re listening at all
    Get out of that limo
    Look us in the eye
    Call us on the cell phone
    Tell us all why

    In Dayton, Ohio
    Or Portland, Maine
    Or a cotton gin out on the great high plains
    That’s done closed down along with the school
    And the hospital and the swimming pool
    Dust devils dance in the noonday heat
    There’s rats in the alley
    And trash in the street
    Gang graffiti on a boxcar door
    We can’t make it here anymore

    Music and lyrics © 2004 by James McMurtry

  4. “Actually, the liberalism of haughty White elites is almost always about their sense of superiority over the rubes out in flyover country.” (Prozium)

    My take is that the liberalism of haughty white elites is exoterically altruistic, high-minded, and generous. Esoterically, it’s a front for exploitative and parasitic capitalist policies that transfer wealth away from the middle-class white family. That’s the dynamic regarding white elites–not their useful idiots: garden-variety libtards.

    Garden-variety libtards are motivated by their own sense of mediocrity, if not outright inferiority. They are feckless do-gooders hopelessly in search of a purpose. Their modus operandi is to search out clients and pity-projects among people even more worthless than themselves. Hence the liberals’ ostentatious displays of concern over tribal peoples, sexual nonconformists, African morons, and illegal aliens. With libtards, it’s all about looking for someone to feel superior to.

    This applies especially to slovenly and trollish “revolutionaries” who engage in grandiose class-struggle when not otherwise engaged–i.e. patronizing the Turlock Dairy Queen. (No offense, Robert.)

  5. Yes, Mr. Salter, the hero of the racists! This academic says, “Racism is good for you!” Or it’s adaptive, or whatever. But he’s wrong. It’s called Salter’s Fallacy:

    http://www.gnxp.com/MT2/archives/003447.html

    Anyway, whether or not in-group breeding is good or bad is not really relevant. Salter says it’s good for our genes. Others say it’s bad for our genes. Really, who cares?

    My point is that there is no way that humans are genetically driven to mate within the tribe and not outside the tribe. If anything, the evidence is that many humans will have a tendency to outbreed. This is also typical of groups of mammals, birds and even plants. And it’s a core principle of evolutionary biology that outbreeding and genetic diversity is good for the group and islandization and lack of genetic diversity are bad for the group.

    All those countries you listed are big enough that inbreeding is not an issue. But in small tribes, it gets to be a problem real quick. I worked as a cultural anthropologist for a local Indian tribe for a while, so I know my anthropology. Suffice to say that taking brides or husbands from other groups is extremely normal in tribal society. If we were genetically driven to preserve the purity of our genes, this would never occur.

    Of course groups compete and try to drive each other extinct. But the victims don’t seem to fret about the purity of their genes, as they love to introduce their genes into other groups and conquered genes into their own, no problem. There even seems to be a genetic imperative to do so.

    The Japanese are as mixed as Indians. So-called race mixing occurred in India 3,500 years with the introduction of genes from the Near East with the indigenous genes of Dravidian types that were indigenous. There is no evidence that this “mixing” harmed this group in any way whatsoever.

    The mixing in North Africa occurred 15-20,000 years ago when Europeans (really Arabids) from Europe moved into Northern Africa and displaced Blacks living there. The result were new races of humans in that region. There’s nothing screwed up or maladaptive about them. In fact, it was this Black-White mixed group that created Ancient Egypt.

    Mass race-mixing occurred much more recently in Japan. 2,100 years ago, Koreans invaded Japan and slowly conquered the native Australoid Ainu. Of the next couple millenia, it was done and the Japanese are now 60% Korean and 40% Ainu more or less. This was a more extreme race-mixing project than the Indian one, and it was a lot more recent.

    Brazil is recently mixed in with a variety of groups. It’s one of the wealthiest nations in Latin America.

    Mixing isn’t a problem. Humans have been doing it forever, it’s just normal. How well it turns out depends on the nature and quality of the stocks being mixed.

    If “race-mixing” were inherently bad as White nationalist lunatics think, all animal and plant breeders would have gone out of business a long time ago. The whole business of breeding animals and plants adaptively is based on mixing different breeds. Many highly superior and adaptive strains of domestic mammals and food plants have resulted from this “race-mixing.”

    The argument that “race-mixing” destroyed Ancient Egypt and “every empire that existed” is always used by the racists and Nazis, but I don’t think there’s any evidence for it. I doubt if you could find one quality historian who would agree with you.

  6. BTW Trainspotter–Good rebuttal of all the tardish, hybrid-vigor-type arguments that under-informed people make about the virtues of “race-mixing.” Lindsay’s figured out a few things: blacks aren’t a race of rocket scientists. Beyond the basics, he’s got a long way to go.

    And as for Silver’s hysterical attribution of genocidal and exploitative intentions to the pro-white crowd–it’s ridiculous projection. We’re willing to live and let live. It’s you guys who don’t want us to go off on our own. We don’t want non-whites around in significant numbers. We can’t exploit that-which-does-not-dwell-amongst-us. Get it?

    (And no, I’m not proposing violent or extra-political means of reaching a state of separation for those who want to be separate. Whosoever wants to remain in the EPIC-FAIL-that-is-the-Multi-Cult…knock yourselves out. We don’t care.)

  7. One more thing: You guys have never told me how you are going to pull of this White Separatist project of yours. Every sane person (not you guys) I discuss it with starts laughing and says it’s not possible or feasible, and it will never occur.

    How exactly do you propose to pull this outrage off?
    Why don’t you lay it on the line for us, because for the life of me, I can’t see how you do it.

    #1, I think you need to amend the Constitution to make your secessionist thing legal.

    The Northwest Republic thing is not possible because there are 2.5 million non-Whites there even before you secede. What to do with them?

    And how do you go about seceding anyway?

  8. 1.) I’m not following you. As you know, the displacement of the North American Indians was followed by a massive increase in the Anglo-American population. The small founding population of colonials on the Atlantic coast grew through natural increase into tens of millions during the nineteenth century.

    The evolutionary reward reaped by America’s founding stock had to be one of the greatest demographic success stories of all time. The same is true of the plant and animal species they brought with them from Europe (which spread like wildfire). In what way were their racial beliefs non-adaptive? The frequency of Anglo-American genes in the territory that became the United States must have increased by several hundred orders of magnitude.

    2.) Suppose for a moment that the Founders had kept America open to non-White immigration from the beginning. Would the White population have grown to anything near the extent that it ultimately did? If you grant that this is extremely unlikely, then how can you possibly argue that America’s traditional racial values were non-adaptive?

    3.) Whites tend to have smaller families than sub-Saharan Africans and a much higher rate of parental investment. In a purely Darwinian sense, Whites are being outcompeted by Africans, but does it necessarily follow that our standard of living will improve as a consequence? Should public policy be governed by purely Darwinian considerations?

    4.) White Nationalists can see what miscegenation has produced in places like the Dominican Republic, Brazil, and Mexico. No one here is ever going to be swayed by that model.

    5.) Only a lunatic would argue that a combination of racial nihilism, low birthrates, abortion on demand, feminism, anti-racism, massive non-White immigration, and miscegenation somehow constitute an adaptive evolutionary strategy for Whites. The frequency of White genes is decreasing relative to the general American population.

  9. And as for Silver’s hysterical attribution of genocidal and exploitative intentions to the pro-white crowd–it’s ridiculous projection. We’re willing to live and let live. It’s you guys who don’t want us to go off on our own. We don’t want non-whites around in significant numbers. We can’t exploit that-which-does-not-dwell-amongst-us. Get it?

    Wade, it’s pretty rich for someone who talks about projection to so brazenly put words in my mouth. I understand very well that you just wish to live and let live — so do I and I’ve said so explicitly in recent comments. If you could somehow manage to read what’s on the lines instead of only what you imagine is between them you’d realize I claim that cooperation and collaboration is both possible and warranted.

    Now, if you were referring to my statements to Freddy Braun, they’ve got nothing to do with separation. Racialism doesn’t necessarily imply his worldview. It’s perfectly possible to be a leftist social reformer type (which I regard myself, minus the leftie economic nutjobbery and sports jackets with patches on the elbows) and a racialist at the same time. “Get it”?

  10. A hundred years ago, the notion that a mulatto would be sitting in the White House in 2009 would have provoked uproarious rounds of laughter. The futurists of the age imagined some wild scenarios, but no one predicted such an event at the time. Yet it has since come to pass.

    You’re forgetting how powerless the NAACP was back in 1909. In the twentieth century, flukes like the Second World War and the Cold War changed the course of history. There was nothing inevitable about the triumph of anti-racism. It was largely the product of random events that otherwise might not have happened.

    What if Lenin had been assassinated or Hitler had become a successful artist? Chances are Barack Obama would not be President of the United States.

    How would White Nationalists come to power? It would depend on similar unseen historical events working out in our favor.

  11. Just browsed over the comments on Lindsay’s blog. He doesn’t respond to the fact that ethnocentrism, xenophobia, and tribalism are the norm across almost all known human societies. The weight of the evidence suggests that it is their opposites – ethnomasochism, xenophilia, and universalism – which are unnatural.

  12. Silver–I was responding to your comment #29, where you quote my previous entry and then launch into a tirade against “revulsionists” and all the wicked and supremacist intentions they harbor toward “we poor bastards near or at the bottom.” Intentionally or not, you’ve mistakenly associated me with “revulsionist” ideas. That’s what I was responding to. I didn’t mean to put words in your mouth or thoughts in your head, and presumably you didn’t mean to do the same to me. Let’s call it a miscommunication and move on, shall we?

  13. ” Every sane person (not you guys) I discuss it with starts laughing and says it’s not possible or feasible, and it will never occur.”

    There is the question of getting from ‘here’ to ‘there’ but the fact that even Larger Empires then the United States have fallen in recent times (I write of the Soviet Union) gives hope that once enough people wake up from the anti-White nightmare that the USA might fall as well!

    Besides you have to know your ‘destination’ (White Ethno-state) before you can map out a way there!! White Nationalism is making great progress with increased interest on the web and High-brow stuff like The Occidental Quarterly coming along to help plot the way Forward!

  14. Leftists don’t cotton to… honest discussions about Jewish influence…

    This is false. Leftists are way ahead of conservatives on this front. Aside from the miniscule paleocon movement, conservatives basically worship Israel and “God’s Chosen”.

    Conservatives generally aren’t very good about race issues either. Mainstream conservatives are huge on politically correct “race doesn’t matter!” talk. From personal experience, if I say something like “non-white immigration should be curtailed because it is leading to increased ethnic conflict in the United States”, I will get more nods from liberals than conservatives. Conservatives may be better on issues like affirmative action, but again only because “race doesn’t matter” and “AA is bad for blacks!”

    Also, if I may say something “Nordicist” here, and this is just a personal observation which may not be entirely valid, but I find that liberal, counter-cultural type whites who are into stuff like yoga and organic gardening are often times “whiter” and more “Nordic” than the evangelical Christian crowd, which tends to have a stronger mestizo/mulatto component.

  15. Pat Buchanan has also spoken about wanting to turn back the clock to the DC racial makeup of his youth. I guess we’re the first generation to come of age in a shithole. Maybe that’s why they think a non-radical solution can work.

  16. La Raza an anti-racist civil rights group? So their mantra “For the race, everything, outside of the race, nothing” is a call for interracial amity and good will towards non-Mexicans?

    Another fact that Bobby L. has difficulty grasping is that genetic isolation is a major prerequisite for evolution to occur. Someone mentioned Iceland and rightfully so. They have one of the most orderly societies with the most beautiful women on the planet. And they achieved this without importing Somalis, Mestizos and Asians? Astonishing.

    Racially mixed societies, the supposed natural state of affairs according to Bobby, are wracked by poverty, violence, disease and strife. The lighter skinned mongrels are often at odds with the darker skinned peoples as evidenced in Haiti and Brazil. Please name a first world nation primarily peopled by those of mixed race lineage?

  17. “My point is that there is no way that humans are genetically driven to mate within the tribe and not outside the tribe. If anything, the evidence is that many humans will have a tendency to outbreed.” ( — Robert Lindsay)

    That’s Lindsay’s fallacy (trotted out by others as well of course). Why, then, is all the multifaceted lockdown needed til we “get our minds right”? Furthermore: Had the proposal for open borders and what we have now been clearly laid out and debated honestly, no PC restrictions on language, the whole enchilada laid out for the people, the whole future in clearest, simplest terms, in 1965, then voted on in a binding referendum, the people would have rejected it overwhelmingly. Maybe part of the reason would have been they didn’t relish losing their race? Probably so. But whatever the reason, it wouldn’t have passed. So apparently following the sexual urges on a one-on-one basis (“See that black girl over there? Yeah, I’d do her”) isn’t duplicated when sober decisions affecting a community’s or nation’s large-scale demographic future are considered. If whites are so eager to get race-replaced, Robert, why did the 1965 law have to be the equivalent (considering its epochal portent) of snuck through? Why the lockdown now on honestly discussing its “blessings”? Why are we all cowering under pseudonyms merely in order to speak truth to power? Why are some refusing to engage out of fear? Why are some rotting in jail for speaking “hate”? Where exactly is this threat everyone is so scared of coming from? Who’s responsible for it? Who’s generating it?

    So much for your “humans have a tendency to outbreed.”

  18. I once heard a true story: an above-middle-age Negro from the inner city was in the hospital for prostate cancer. His doctors told him, using technical language instead of plain language, that castration might slow the cancer down. He consented. Shortly before the operation a doctor visiting him at the bedside wondered if he understood. When his questions told him the man didn’t understand, he said, “Do you know what they’re going to do to you? They’re going to cut your balls off.” The man immediately turned down the surgery and requested additional time to think about his options.

    In 1965 the American people were like that man, and the ones pushing the genocidal Hart-Celler immigration bill (mainly U.S. organized Jewry as Prof. MacDonald has proven) were like the doctors who didn’t speak to them in plain language about what they were going to do.

    Why did it have to be done that way, Robert, if white people are so eager to embrace their own race-replacement?

  19. Right now they’re lying to the people. The people want a stop to race-replacement, they want what might be called immigration reform in other words, but true immigration reform, so the powers-that-be have come up with a plan for even worse and even quicker race-replacement — the exact opposite of what the people want, the exact opposite of what they think of as “immigration reform,” and lyingly called it “Immigration Reform” to fool the people. To quote English MEP David Hannon, you know that, Robert, I know it, and you know that I know it, so don’t play dumb. They’re deliberately lying to the people about “Immigration Reform.” Why, Robert, you communist “champion of the people”? Why are the people being lied to in this way if they want to be race-replaced?

    Another lie: The people think illegal immigration is what’s race-replacing them, so tend not to complain about legal race-replacement immigration, or even to be aware of it, thinking falsely if illegal is ended the race-replacement would stop. Why are the powers that be deliberately allowing the people to labor under this misconception, Robert, this lie, you communist “champion of the people,” if “the people want race-replacement”? Can’t the people be trusted with the truth, Robert?

  20. Most White Americans have never considered the question, “Do you want to be race replaced?” So it’s dubious that US Whites really want it. However, a majority of Americans do not support ending all immigration. Ending all non-White immigration is preposterous, and I would say only a small # of US Whites support it. So your proposals are fanatical. You guys support either ending all immigration (I don’t think one nation on Earth has done this) or ending all non-White immigration (so crazy it can’t even be considered a serious proposal).

    It’s not so much that US Whites “want race replacement” but that have never considered the question.

    Humans do have a tendency to outbreed. I’ve worked as a cultural anthropologist in a paid position for on a government grant, and I’ve read the literature. Most all tribes outbreed to some extent. It’s adaptive because it introduces new and possible adaptive genes into the tribe and mostly because it prevents inbreeding. The healthiest mammal populations are the most genetically diverse. The least healthy are the least genetically diverse – in fact, we often consider them headed to extinction due to lack of diversity. So much for your theories!

    While people have a tendency to outbreed, true, they are also paradoxically ethnocentric and xenophobic. People are very interesting! Nevertheless, even extremely ethnocentric and xenophobic human groups still outbreed anyway! I saw it firsthand with the Indians I worked with. They are almost as hyperethnocentric as Jews, yet they are massively outbreeding. Out of a tribe of 800, there is one pureblood left. Further, not only have they bred in with non-Indians, they have also very heavily bred in with surrounding Indian tribes, even the ones that are their ancient and hated enemies! Humans are weird.

    Despite the outbreeding tendency, humans often don’t like immigration or especially mass immigration, particularly of unlike groups. Why? Probably because it looks like an foreign invasion. Generally, tribes, despite an outbreeding tendency, will always resist a foreign invasion and they do not like to be genetically swamped. Also, despite the tendency to outbreed, people still like to live in a culture that is fairly uniform in most ways.

    La Raza an anti-racist civil rights group? So their mantra “For the race, everything, outside of the race, nothing” is a call for interracial amity and good will towards non-Mexicans?

    That’s a lie. That’s not their slogan. It’s MECHA’s slogan. MECHA is very radical.

    Please name a first world nation primarily peopled by those of mixed race lineage?

    There are many such societies in the Arab Gulf. The people are Black-White mixes. This is the thing that you guys hate the most. They are not “wracked by poverty, violence, disease and strife” at all. For the most part, they look like Phoenix or the South Beach in Miami.

  21. “There are many such societies in the Arab Gulf. The people are Black-White mixes. This is the thing that you guys hate the most. They are not “wracked by poverty, violence, disease and strife” at all. For the most part, they look like Phoenix or the South Beach in Miami.”

    Ah our friend Robert engaging in more wishful thinking regarding the way he wishes things were around the world, rathern than what they are in fact.

    FYI, Blacks in Muslim lands are the lowest people on the Arab totem pole. Some of their very names for them attest to this – Al Akhdam — The Servants!

    ==
    “They have lived in Yemen for well over a thousand years. They are Arabic-speaking Muslims. And yet they are Yemen’s great outcasts. Meet the Akhdam.

    The photo at right is a snapshot from one of the Akhdam shanty-towns in Yemen’s capital. As one article notes, this street slum lies “virtually in the shadows of the multi-million-dollar presidential mosque, and is made up of squat cinderblock buildings and shacks made from scrap materials. It sits on a waterway that fills up in the winter, turning the pathways into rivulets and dirt floors into muck.”

    “Legend has it that the Black Yemenis, who do not belong to any of the major Arab tribe groups, descend from Ethiopian invaders from the sometime between 100-600 A.D. When the Ethiopian invasion failed, they became slaves and servants. With the abolition of slavery in Yemen (in 1962!), the Akhdam are now all “free” but face widespread discrimination and economic hardship:

    “—They are almost always kept at arms length, and any chance of social integration is next to impossible. Their name, akhdam, is the plural of the Arabic term khadim, which literally means servant, a term far predating their common occupation nowadays as sanitary workers and garbage collectors, and is given to any Yemeni-born person with black skin, especially in the north of the country.—”
    http://www.ordoesitexplode.com/me/2005/11/minority_report.html
    ==

    Nice try Rob. Talk to ya later, alligator.

  22. Honestly, does anyone here care what most Whites happen to think about race, in particular those from California who have bankrupted their state?

  23. Granted, there is a minority tendency to outbreed, which Lindsay is wildly overstating here and conflating with xenophilia. But clearly the vast majority of humans prefer to inbreed within their ethnic group. Why is that?

    As I pointed out above, xenophobia, tribalism, and ethnocentrism are typical traits found in almost all human societies. There isn’t any paradox. These attitudes exist because they are adaptive: when you mate within your ethny, more of your genes are passed along into the next generation.

    Lindsay makes much of males of dominant tribes taking the females of defeated tribes to bed, but he has nothing to say about the fact that the males of those tribes don’t like this behavior at all.

  24. I think that Salter’s theories are absolutely nonsensical, and he has zero evidence to back them up. Sure, we want to breed mostly with those who look like us, speak our language, share our culture, etc. Sure, we are all ethnocentric, and sadly, xenophobia and tribalism are human tendencies. But mixing has been the story of mankind. A review of the history of Europe in the past 2000 years shows this very well. A review even of my own genetic line shows this. The French went to England and massively bred in. So did the Danes. So did the Anglo-Saxons. Germanic tribes, Normans, Greeks, Spaniards, Arabs and Albanians all went to Italy and bred in hugely with the locals. We could go on and on here but why? Germanic tribes invaded all over Europe and left their genes there. There was a huge invasion of Vietnam by Chinese 2000 years now, they massively bred in, and these are the Vietnamese. Were we really inclined only to breed with our own, invasions would just set up huge enclaves in conquered lands and not breed in with the locals. Yet the tendency of invaders is to breed in and wash their genes with the others. Generally, an extragenetic factor called Culture has to be erected to keep humans from breeding out in huge numbers. This is probably done mostly so languages and cultures can stay intact. Most people that breed within the tribe do so because it is customary, not because it is something they are genetically programmed to do.

    Anyway, if massive outbreeding were not normal, there would be no need for White nationalism, an extragenetic Culture some Whites are attempting erect to keep Whites from doing what comes naturally – outbreed.

    At the end of the day it doesn’t matter whether outbreeding or breeding within the tribe is more normal than the other, or which one is genetic, which can hardly be proved anyway. You guys want to discourage Whites from outbreeding, and you think that’s the better way to go. That’s all that counts here, not whether you have Nature or History on your side or not.

  25. I referred to the wealthy nations of the Gulf. Yes, there are oppressed minorities there. Same as in the 3rd World. I did not intend to include Yemen.

    Hawaii is a very wealthy state and it’s as mixed as you can get.

    The notion that “race-mixing” results in dysfunctional societies is bizarre. You won’t a geneticist on Earth to agree with that. It all depends on the stocks being mixed. Breeding humans is not that much different from breeding dogs, cats, horses, corn or potatoes.

  26. “Isn’t our friend Razib from there?”

    Filthy Razib is a Bangladeshi immigrant from the poorest country in the world. Have you seen a photograph of this brownster? He’s darker than your random bone-in-the-nose sub-Saharan Nigger. He switches links to an interracial porn movie if you post something from genexpression on a W.N. board. It’s normal scummy behavior for Jews and muds. That’s how they operate.

  27. Lindsay is trying to rationalize his own race-mixing. It’s all about him.
    I’m not surprised that a poster who miscegenates (and the various Asiatics, Jews, and racial mongrels who post on genexpession) cannot see how racial mixing = genocide. Perhaps Lindsay should read the U.N. definition of genocide, which includes the idea that conditions that prevent the survival of any group can be considered genocide. Thus, multiracialism – leading to displacement and mixing – IS genocide.
    And, it doesn’t matter whether the aliens are “high IQ” or not.

    Miscegenation, like suicidal tendencies, is a form of mental disorder and a sign of sociopathology.

    As to chieftains who kidnap women. That’s a laughable argument. Neighboring tribes are normally closely related to each other. It’s not like Swedes ever lived next to Bantus. Until modern migration flows, that is.

  28. Robert Lindsay’s a complete waste of time. If anything along the lines of a normal societal set-up ever gets off the ground just send his ilk to their choice of Soweto, Guinea-Bissau (does that still exist?) or Port Moresby with one of those explosive collars around their necks that Arnold Schwarzenegger wore in the ’80s film “Running Man” that explode if you try to leave the place.

  29. Robert Lindsay:”Sure, we want to breed mostly with those who look like us, speak our language, share our culture, etc. Sure, we are all ethnocentric, and sadly, xenophobia and tribalism are human tendencies. ”

    Why is this “sad”? If it were not for such tendencies, we would not have many of the distinct cultures that we have today. What would be so good about a uniform, bland, mediocre IQ brown blob? But let’s be honest, that’s not what is going to happen. The non-white races, by and large, have secure homelands. They aren’t going to be mixed out of existence. Only whites, amongst the major peoples, are threatened with marginalization, displacement and ultimate extinction. You know this, Robert. Let’s not play silly games. Let’s not pretend this is happening to everyone. It isn’t. It is clearly directed against whites, and whites alone. The Han Chinese are still going to be there.

    As to your comments of mixing being common in history, well, no shit Sherlock. The results of mixing whites with non-whites, whether it be in Latin America, North Africa, Asia and so forth have been basically disastrous – for whites. But here’s the thing: if you would prefer to live in the slums of Brazil, with murder and rape rampant, go for it buddy. YOU live there, along with you pro-mixing ilk. YOU live there. Got that? But the pro-mixing scum doesn’t make that choice, does it? No, they don’t want to live there. But they do get an evil, giddy pleasure from watching previously white communities destroyed and submerged under the brown tide. They are nothing but malevolent, evil, twisted punks. White nationalists don’t want to stop you from living in a mixed society. I, for one, would insist upon it. You don’t deserve to live in a white society.

    RL ” The notion that “race-mixing” results in dysfunctional societies is bizarre.”

    LOL!!! Bizarre?? Um…look around the planet, dude. Hell, look around your own neighborhood. And again, if you think that the mixed hellholes are so great, YOU live there. The slums of Rio await you. But you and your kind aren’t going to do that, eh? There are still too many “whitebread” communities where whites can live happily, free of murder and rape. And that just won’t do at all, will it? The pro-mixer will not rest as long as some place, somewhere, there is a white woman yet left unraped.

    RL “Anyway, if massive outbreeding were not normal, there would be no need for White nationalism, an extragenetic Culture some Whites are attempting erect to keep Whites from doing what comes naturally – outbreed.”

    You know, Robert, you are completely full of crap. Seriously. Reality: for centuries, whites did very little mixing in North America. Some, but little. Again, centuries.

    Then, with the cultural revolution in this country, that began to change – somewhat. Was there a great clamor amongst whites for miscegenation, as they eagerly awaited to bed down with the Negro? Of course not. This was a top down imposition on white society, not a ground up movement. With the media and educational institutions firmly and completely in the hands of pro-mixers, the most massive and sustained propaganda effort in the history of mankind was directed at whites in America. And STILL the vast majority don’t mix. Massive wave after wave of non-white immigration, and STILL most whites breed with their own. Doesn’t this clue you in on something?

    You try to paint this ridiculous picture of whites bursting at the seams with the desire to breed with non-whites. It’s just not true. Now, having said that, the anti-white propaganda campaign is indeed having an effect, and it does manage to peel off a significant minority of whites. Furthermore, the sheer magnitude of the non-white birthrate and non-white immigration, gradually swamping the white population, will of course have an effect. And, that effect is going to be marginalization and displacement (already very much in evidence) and ultimate extinction. This result comes about not from some great desire among most whites to mix, but rather the peeling off of marginal whites over time…and simultaneously swamping them through massive non-white immigration. Again, it is a top down imposition that weakens whites over time, not overnight.

    If we have a white ethnostate, on the other hand, of course white people should be free to leave the country and become members of any multi-racial hellhole that will have them. Then they can mix to their hearts content, and mercifully their sick and suicidal genes will be removed from the white gene pool. But you and I both know that few would do that. Some, but very few. And for every nutty white that did that, a hundred more whites would be seeking entry into the clean, stable and progressive white nation. We would thus guarantee our survival, which is all we seek. We do not seek to deny you your multiracial hellholes. You seek to deny us our survival. You are the bad guys, not us.

    So cut the crap, Robert. What is happening has nothing to do with some groundswell desire for the white population to mix. Instead, this is being done TO the white population, by an elite that hates it. It’s telling that most of the propaganda is aimed at young white women who are at a very vulnerable stage in their lives. Really sick stuff, and then people like you try to candycoat it. I call bullshit.

  30. “It’s normal scummy behavior for Jews and muds. That’s how they operate.”

    Does that mean you’re done fellating the Jews?

  31. Robert,
    La Raza (The Race) has very close ties with Mecha and has never demanded they repudiate their racist slogan. La Raza is, therefore, guilty by association. Furthermore, many La Raza members are ex-“Mechistas” who’ve never disavowed any previous ties to the group.

  32. 1.) I’ve never read any of Salter’s work before, so I won’t comment on his theories, but from what I gather he has only restated common sense in a more complex way: it is natural for humans to favor their own kin over non-kin (close relatives share a higher percentage of one’s own genes) and this has a hereditary basis.

    2.) The universal distribution of tribalism, xenophobia, and ethnocentrism across all known human societies is proof that these are adaptive behaviors. You claim that “mixing has been the story of mankind,” but have little to say about the barriers which human societies are constantly erecting against gene flow. The vast majority of people breed within their own ethnic group, but you gloss over that, and instead focus on the less common tendency to outbreed.

    Historically speaking, I pointed out above that males haven’t had such a cavalier attitude about their own women. Raping the women of conquered tribes is one thing (this increases the frequency of one’s own genes in a given territory), but standing idly by alien males fuck one’s own wives, sisters, and cousins is another matter altogether. Where is the genetic benefit in that? Your genes would become less common in the next generation. Hence, the perfectly natural feeling of disgust and revulsion that White men experience when they see mudsharks on the arms of negroes.

    It is easy to see why tribalism, xenophobia, and ethnocentrism evolved. These attitudes prevent such genetic contamination from happening. Their function is to promote the survival of one’s own line in future generations. When you inbreed with a distant cousin, more of your genes are passed along into the next generation.

    In contrast, the xenophilia, ethnomasochism, and universalism promoted by the Left doesn’t seem to have evolved anywhere. These attitudes expedite the swift dissolution of the groups which practice them. They never reach evolutionary stability.

    In California, your own state, the race replacement of liberal Whites with anemic birthrates by ethnocentric Hispanics with large families is far advanced.

    3.) You have it exactly backwards: it is perfectly natural to be a xenophobic, ethnocentric, tribalistic bigot. It takes a repressive culture of critique imposed from the top down by hostile elites and ruthless policing by disciplinary “watchdog” organizations to maintain the system we have in place today.

    4.) The Left’s programme is a total evolutionary loser for Whites: feminism, abortion on demand, consumerism, miscegenation, mass third world immigration, racial preferences. God himself couldn’t design a more perfect cocktail for decreasing the frequency of White genes in the American population.

    5.) Central Africa has to be one of the most genetically diverse places on Earth. You can always emigrate there.

  33. Fade, you must, must, must read Salter’s monograph on ethnic genetic interests. I cannot emphasis the capital importance of that work. It’s my Bible. It guides all of my attitudes on race and immigration. No book has been more important to me or had a greater impact. Do yourself a favor and pick up a copy.

    http://books.google.ca/books?id=kslga1MfT1gC&dq=Salter+book+ethnic+genetic+interests&printsec=frontcover&source=bn&hl=en&ei=au1oSpujOpWsNubIoNAM&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4

  34. Masterful demolition of the whiny, toadish Robert Lindsay in the entries above, Prozium. You have incredible patience, which is probably misplaced. I have a feeling Lindsay’s not only a little dense–he’s being thick on purpose. He trots out tired old canards from the likes of Gould and Lewontin, and seems to have an endless store of bad-faith arguments to pull -ab anus- after his previous string of fallacies have been utterly revoked–as they invariably are. I’m betting Lindsay’s a troll in the activist sense–not just on account of his generally sloppy and dumpy appearance.

    Perhaps living in Mexifornia, his line has become so hopelessly mingled and jumbled into the Multi-Cult that he regards white racialists as a personal threat. Or maybe he’s just another fake dissenter: a weenie pseudo-intellectual who only parrots “controversial” ideas that go so far, but pulls back in fear from reasoning things through to their brutal and nihilistic conclusions. Robert Lindsay tip-toes to the brink of Nietzsche’s abyss, squeals “eek!” like a mouse, and flees back to the protective warmth of familiar liberal bromides. He’s a philosophical man-child, swaddled in cheap, Chinese-made fabrics purchased at some Central Valley Walmart, notwithstanding his socialist and anti-capitalist pretentions.

  35. “3.) You have it exactly backwards: it is perfectly natural to be a xenophobic, ethnocentric, tribalistic bigot. It takes a repressive culture of critique imposed from the top down by hostile elites and ruthless policing by disciplinary “watchdog” organizations to maintain the system we have in place today.”

    Truer words were never spoken. Cultural Marxism & Multiculturalism are a tyranny of the mind and soul similar in many ways to communist tyranny visited upon the hapless Russians and E. Europeans. Perhaps that’s because both ideologies were spawned by Jews and brutally enforced by a police state designed by the very same people.

  36. Trainspotter too has pile-driven Lindsay head-first into the concrete of genetic and evolutionary science. But dumbly and shamelessly Lindsay plows on–not about to let intellectual integrity get in the way of his obsessive attention-seeking. The spectacle of Lindsay, knocked cold time after time, rising again to attack with the same broken weapons is pure Monty Python: “Tis but a scratch!” the eviscerated, limbless, and mangled torso of Lindsay proclaims. And in his own mind, it’s true. Some abnormality in Robert’s runtish and semi-autistic brain precludes him from realizing how utterly he’s been defeated. Denial is the ever the refuge of the weak.

  37. “Lindsay is trying to rationalize his own race-mixing. It’s all about him.”

    Good call, Herr Friedrich!

    Seriously guys, Robert has stated on a few occasions that he has mixed-race nieces/nephews — and that he extensively dates outside the race. So this shouldn’t take a psychologist to figure out that he is attempting to rationalize his (likely) cognitive dissonance.

    He also has stated in this thread that he is egocentric and is concerned with what is primarily good for him. Typical ‘Leftist’ (LOL).

    Paradoxically, for someone like our friend Robert, who purportedly claims to ‘care nothing’ about race and genes, he seems to have a encyclopedial knowledge of his own ancestry, down to the smallest details and distinctions (what with “Lombardic Italy” and all)!

    Ah yes, comrade Rob.

  38. I hereby sentence Robert Lindsay to the rest of his life as a minority in non-White California. May God have mercy on his soul. 😉

  39. Wade Williams:
    “The spectacle of Lindsay, knocked cold time after time, rising again to attack with the same broken weapons is pure Monty Python: “Tis but a scratch!” the eviscerated, limbless, and mangled torso of Lindsay proclaims.”

    LOL!! Good stuff. It’s such a one sided slaughter with these guys, whether it be the Lindsays of the left or the Monitors of the fake right. White nationalist poster after poster lands haymaker after haymaker, and yet always “Tis but a scratch!”

    It really goes to show that, intellectually at least, our opponents run on nothing but hot air, platitudes, misrepresentations and candycoated bullshit. It’s gotten to the point where our average posters can demolish their first raters. These threads are Exhibits A through Z as to why the establishment cannot allow our views a fair airing or honest debate in front of the broad white public. What you are seeing above really is the best that they’ve got. Which in essence means: they got nothin’. As Linder is fond of pointing out, they demonize, smear and suppress us because they HAVE to. In anything resembling an equal playing field, they get wiped out.

  40. In my mind’s eye I envision Lindsay sitting in his “study”: The dingy room is a mess–a computer desk and its surroundings are strewn with Taco Bell wrappers and plastic Starbucks cups. The consumerist debris bears mute testimony to the disposability of Robert’s lonely existence. Within these four walls, the majority of his tragicomic life plays itself out–online, naturally.

    For this is the hobbit-hole of a lifelong and involuntary bachelor.

    The eyes of womankind will never look upon the benighted interior of Robert’s dingy domicile. No nose-of-Eve will ever smell the strange scents emanating from his murky bunker. This is the “Beagle’s Lair,” whence Robert plans his thrice-lame sallies against Occidental Dissent and other exponents of hate and darkness. To the profane and uninitiated, the portly and disheveled creature slouched over the keyboard inspires pathos and regret. -Shame on them who have so little faith!-

    For this man is a Marxist Hero of the People, not some middle-aged dork to be trifled with! How dare the readers of Occidental Dissent not recognize this “swaggering cocky prick” for the “King of the World” he is, instead of dismissing him as a perennially-celibate loser of dubious ethnic provenance! O Ye Haters of Occidental Dissent: Greet this Prince of Humanity on bended knee. Show him the respect he deserves. And never, NEVER write him off as just another booger-eating leftist nerd.

  41. LOL! Wade, seriously, that’s classic stuff. You’ve got a gift for that style of writing. Stylish mockery kicks ass.

  42. About this “involuntary bachelor” shit. I don’t much care what people do with their sex lives, after all, this is California, and even celibates are just fine here. Hey, it’s just another lifestyle.

    But you’re barking up the wrong tree. I’ve never married, so it’s left me plenty of time to date. I’ve dated hundreds of women and girls, and I’ve had sex with over 100 of them. I’d say I’ve had sex with over 50 nonwhite girls and women, but I’m guessing. I’ve had tons of sex in my life. So much, I don’t even care about it anymore.

    Re: fast food, I’m a health food nut and I cook my own food. I look way younger than most guys my age, and I don’t have a belly. I’m not slovenly, people say I look “preppy.” But I do dress down California- bohemian style. Understand you can be Left Bank cafe society year round here.

    About whether or not you are beating me in the arguments, it’s really irrelevant, isn’t it? My types (actually, people far, far worse than me) have the culture by the balls and our grip is getting tighter and tighter by the day.

    Here in California, White ethnocentrism is dead and buried. The general opinion around here is that a White person who says, like you all do, “I hate race-mixing,” is a wild, scavenging animal that needs to be shot on sight. You can’t even say the word “race-mixing” here. If you do, you sound like George Wallace, and people will tell you to get out of the state and go back to Mississippi.

    That sort of talk is not allowed around here in public or probably otherwise. There are a few that think like that, but most people just think they are loons.

    Bottom line is that ideological worth is irrelevant. We’ve won here (and in the US as a whole), and you guys have lost. Not only that, but we keep winning more and more every day, and you guys keep getting further behind.

    You should feel lucky your “views are not allowed a fair airing in the media.” If one of you guys gets on TV to give us your “fair airing” and starts denouncing “race-mixers”, 90% of the Whites around here will try to kick your picture on the screen. There’s no support for your ideas. If you’re given a platform, you’ll only get way more people against you and turn off the few leaning your way.

  43. I don’t see why people fell for Lindsay’s act, that he’d “changed.” This is the same Lindsay who used to come to MajorityRights.com five years ago to taunt, the exact same, no difference. He’s a race-replacement advocate and has the nerve to argue with me over being called that. This person is a totally lost cause. He’s like that white woman journalist in The New & Improved South Africa who got gang-raped by the Negroes and blamed it on the white Patriarchy or something. These people can’t think. Some people are like that, they literally cannot think. To bandy words with them is a fool’s errrand. This guy is unchanging filth.

  44. Honestly, what’s the point of all the ugly and intellectually dishonest Jewish type logical fallacy argumentation using the ad hominem BS? You haven’t the slightest idea how I live my life, and it’s irrelevant to my arguments anyway.

    My clothes are clean, often washed and every spot is meticulously scrubbed out on sight. My place is clean (I have OCD, remember?) though it has the scattered look of an academic’s office (books and papers everywhere). My hair is neat and combed before I go out and repeatedly throughout the day. I have an advanced degree and come off like a university professor.

    Sure, I’m online a lot, but I don’t have to work, as I live off a trust fund. Why work?

    I like women all the way down to 25-30 and I can still get them.

    I’m bowing out of this discussion as it’s degenerated into ad hom silliness.

    I’ll come back if you boys ever start acting like grownups.

    One last thing? You’re implying I’m non-White? Because I’m related to Pocohontas from the 1600’s? Good God, man.

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