Good background music! that’s from Halloween III, Season of the Witch, which is about getting millions of children to don special Halloween masks that are implanted with a chip. The TV instructs the children to put on the masks, and the TV sets off a signal to make the masks detonate and kill off millions of kids all at once. It’s a John Carpenter movie, the same director who made “They Live.”
I thought Halloween III was pretty good. It features an Irish owned costume company planning the mass killings via mask in order to celebrate Samhain and revive the ancient Celtic gods.
I wonder if the idea originally centered around something closer to the truth, and they were forced to make it “Irish” in order to get it made?
John Carpenter is incredibly talented, he created that score, even though he can’t read or write a note.
I like that he relies on suspense and mood rather than excessive gore, which you see too much of today.
He has a unique style that I’ve always enjoyed, some other greats by Carpenter:
They Live
Big Trouble in Little China
The Fog
Escape from New York
The Thing
Christine
Starman
Prince of Darkness
I think it could gain wider distribution if the closing credits did not feature a Swastika. Someone else said somewhere recently that either you think the swastika is inherently evil, or you think it is a one of the oldest sacred symbols of the European. If you are in the latter category it should be kept in a cherished space away from those who would do it harm.
I think it could gain wider distribution if the closing credits did not feature a Swastika. Someone else said somewhere recently that either you think the swastika is inherently evil, or you think it is a one of the oldest sacred symbols of the European. If you are in the latter category it should be kept in a cherished space away from those who would do it harm.
Although I agree the Hakenkreuz should not be shown or used flippantly, especially by hollyweird ‘kostume nazis’ – I feel it is gratuitously insulting to the memory of the brave German and other European soldiers (AND civilians) to whom that symbol meant something, actually a great deal – sacrificing so much fighting the Red Soviet hordes and protecting Europa from the scourge of Asiatic bolshevism.
Jackson,
I agree. The Swastika and the “White Power” message were overly harsh, and I wish they weren’t included, but I thought the video was good enough to post anyway. You echo my own feelings on the subject, which were well expressed by Jost Turner:
“The Swastika is the most sacred symbol of our Folk (and as well, of all mankind who strive to live in harmony with Nature). Never flaunt it! Never render it with specious words or with thoughtless, childish racial slurs! Keep it sacred and singular by sheltering it from the eyes of mankind’s enemies until the day comes when all will gaze on it with honor and reverence!”
Better be careful fellas speaking objectively of National Socialism — or else Jackson might just start posting pictures of the Red hordes storming the Reichstag.
When I first started watching this video, it looked like a Greenpeace promo; it took 3:20 to get to the racialist message. But upon reflection, I can see how this video could be used to racialize white environmental activists. That’s a narrow demographic, but if you think you can do it, have at it.
I personally have a difficult time abiding the company of environmentalists. They remind me too much of anti-racists in their attitudes and mannerisms. They all talk and act like Red Jeffrey.
Found on the net:
TFH April 14, 2010 at 23:23
I strongly believe in free markets and small government.
I stopped voting Republican when I discovered that a Republican/conservative will support any and all leftism that can be packaged as ‘chivalry’. Hence, Republicans have expanded the state just as quickly as Democrats have, even though Republicans *think* they haven’t.
There is no right-wing possible without an accurate understanding of the female brain. At the moment, there is thus no real right-wing in America.
Another Avenue to Prosecute Skeptics
April 11, 2010, 10:33 am At the United Nations, whose general hostility to free speech is fairly well established, a proposal is on the table to allow the prosecution of people, like myself, who publicly disagree with the UN’s position on climate science:
The proposal for the United Nations to accept “ecocide” as a fifth “crime against peace”, which could be tried at the International Criminal Court (ICC), is the brainchild of British lawyer-turned-campaigner Polly Higgins.
The radical idea would have a profound effect on industries blamed for widespread damage to the environment like fossil fuels, mining, agriculture, chemicals and forestry.
Supporters of a new ecocide law also believe it could be used to prosecute “climate deniers” who distort science and facts to discourage voters and politicians from taking action to tackle global warming and climate change.
Joel Kotkin (Jew) wrote an article entitled “America in 2050 — Strength in Diversity” which was rather widely syndicated; here is the opening:
“An ongoing source of strength for the United States over the next 40 years will be its openness to immigration. Indeed, more than most of its chief global rivals, the U.S. will be reshaped and re-energized by an increasing racial and ethnic diversity.”
Jewish behavior and thought-processes are empirically predictable once you know what to look for.
It goes without saying that at the bottom of the article is a Google ad (Google = Jewish owned/managed company) for an interracial dating service featuring a White man with a Black woman – http://www.InterracialRomance.com
Jew Kotkin is the author of the book The Next Hundred Million, which celebrates a hypothetical future in which the 21st Century USA has been flooded by 100+ million non-White immigrants.
I say we send “The Next Hundred Million [non-Whites]” to Kotkin’s Israel! It is only fair compensation for all the American Jews have done for us, no?
I personally have a difficult time abiding the company of environmentalists. They remind me too much of anti-racists in their attitudes and mannerisms. They all talk and act like Red Jeffrey.
When it should be the opposite. Racialism and environmentalism were once linked, and non-whites are much less responsible and concerned about the environment and animals.
Mark: “When it should be the opposite. Racialism and environmentalism were once linked, and non-whites are much less responsible and concerned about the environment and animals.”
I absolutely agree with this statement! 🙂
Indeed, Mark!
Those who loathe Nordicists so much (ahem, Matt), and believe they have no place within the American racialist tradition, should remember that we wouldn’t have any redwood trees remaining if it wasn’t for Madison Grant.
We wouldn’t have the National Park system (my favourite thing about this country) if it weren’t for Teddy Roosevelt.
Nordic-determined White men have done damn fine by the “American Tribe” if you ask me.
Well, please don’t conflate ‘Nordic’ with ‘Nordish’ – since they are not necessarily one and the same thing.
Remember, the indigenous White inhabitants of the British Isles are Atlanto-Mediterranean, and this genetic type is still strongly represented in all the countries of the UK – albeit mixed with Nordic elements. (*Remember also as well that the continental Germanic genetic admixture of the Isles is no more than 20-30%.)
Just look at Madison Grant himself.
Landser,
I am quite aware that they are not the same thing, and I didn’t imply otherwise.
If you are confused because I usually refer to myself as a Nordish preservationist, while I’ve dubbed Grant a Nordicist, that was deliberate. The word Nordish had not been coined in Grant’s time, and he was an unabashed Nordicist.
Much like Dr. Hans F.K. Günther, Grant believed that any serious anthropological assessment of history resulted in a Nordic-determined, even Nordic supremacist, position.
Your assertion that the British Isles were, and are, predominantly Mediterranean is incorrect. The aborigines of Northwestern Europe are the descendants of partially depigmented Upper Paleolithic survivors of the last Ice Age: Brünn and Borreby.
Here is McCulloch’s analysis of the subject, based primarily on Coon’s research:
Aboriginal Northwest European subraces (The descendants of the first peoples to settle in northwest Europe, who retreated to refuge areas in southern France and northern Spain during the Last Glacial Maximum of 20,000-15,000 years ago [18,000-13,000 B.C.], and then re-expanded northward along the coasts of the Atlantic and the North Sea during the final phase of the Upper Paleolithic period circa 15,000-10,000 years ago [13,000-8,000 B.C.])
2. Outer Circle of Periphery Subracial Types
a. Northwestern periphery types (ancient stabilized blends of Inner Circle or Central Nordish inhabitants of northwestern Europe with Atlanto-Mediterraneans who migrated from the Iberian peninsula up the Atlantic coast as far as Norway during the Mesolithic period circa 8,000-4,500 B.C. They entered Great Britain from the west coast whereas Nordic elements later entered from the east coast from northwest Europe.)
……..
1.) North-Atlantid type (associated with megalithic monuments and long barrow burial sites; primary element in Wales, southeast coast of Ireland and western Scotland, common in England; in coloring commonly combines dark hair with light eyes)
2.) Palaeo-Atlantid type (common in Wales and in western England and Scotland from the Midlands to Glasgow, minor element in Norway; hair and eye coloring both dark)
1.) Borreby subrace (named after Danish island site where paleolithic remains were found; principal element in Denmark, southwest coast of Sweden, northern Germany, the Rhineland and the Ruhr, majority element in Wallonia)
2.) Brünn subrace (named after paleolithic site near Brno, or Brünn, Czech Republic; predominant element in western Ireland)
He estimates the distribution of racial types among the indigenous British population as follows:
England = 25% Keltic Nordic (derived from pre-Roman invaders), 15% Anglo-Saxon (post-Roman Germanic invaders, most common in the southeast, especially East Anglia), 15% Brünn {indigenous Paleolithic inhabitants}, 15% North-Atlantid and 10% Palaeo-Atlantid (blend of Mesolithic Atlanto-Mediterranean invaders with both earlier and later arrivals; most common in the Midlands and northwest), 8% Hallstatt Nordic (of Viking and Norman derivation), 5% Trønder (of Norwegian Viking derivation; most common in the northeast), 3% Borreby and 2% Fälish (both of Viking and Norman derivation; associated with the landed gentry; source of the “John Bull” type), 2% Noric (from Bronze-Age invaders) = 100% Nordish (73% central and 27% periphery types)
Scotland = 25% Keltic Nordic, 22% Trønder (most common in the northeast), 10% North-Atlantid (most common in the west), 10% Anglo-Saxon (most common in the southeast), 10% Palaeo-Atlantid (most common in the southwest), 10% Brünn, 5% Hallstatt Nordic, 4% Borreby, 4% Noric = 100% Nordish (76% central and 24% periphery types)
Ireland = 40% Brünn (indigenous Paleolithic inhabitants, most common in the west), 30% Keltic Nordic (most common in the east), 9% North-Atlantid, 9% Borreby, 3% Palaeo-Atlantid, 3% Trønder, 2% Noric, 2% Anglo-Saxon, 1% Hallstatt Nordic = 100% Nordish (86% central and 14% periphery types)
“Nordic-determined White men have done damn fine by the ‘American Tribe’ if you ask me.”
Robert Campbell,
They weren’t advocating the creation of an all White State for Nordics, while planning to leave the other Whites to fend for themselves in areas of the Country that would be dominated by Non-Whites.
They didn’t try to grab most of the French Women for themselves, wrongly pretending they’re closer to Nordics than to Mediterraneans, while hypocritically telling Mediterranean Whites to stay away from their Women.
They weren’t advocating the creation of an all White State for Nordics, while planning to leave the other Whites to fend for themselves in areas of the Country that would be dominated by Non-Whites.
None of the Nordish preservationists here has called for throwing the other Whites to the wolves, so to speak, following victory. I think we all agree that we should work together to secure a greater territory for all Whites. Policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation would follow after this greater territory is secured. So there’s no reason why the other Whites would be imperiled by non-Whites.
They didn’t try to grab most of the French Women for themselves, wrongly pretending they’re closer to Nordics than to Mediterraneans, while hypocritically telling Mediterranean Whites to stay away from their Women.
I thought I was being a bit provocative when I said “lecherous Med” in the other thread, but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?
Your assertion that the British Isles were, and are, predominantly Mediterranean is incorrect. The aborigines of Northwestern Europe are the descendants of partially depigmented Upper Paleolithic survivors of the last Ice Age: Brünn and Borreby.
Robert,
Hi, thanks for the response.
Don’t misunderstand me, I am not at all saying that the British Isles is predominantly Mediterranean. What I am saying is that the aboriginal White population was Atlanto-Mediterranean, who amalgamated with the conquering Nordics and produced the British as we know them today — a people with varying degrees of Nordic and Mediterranean in their national gene pool.
I am familiar with the Brunn-Borreby argument, but respectfully disagree with it. This is essentially Nordicising the old Atlanto-Med indigenous population to fit a political rather than a true anthropological understanding of British population genetics.
As well, here is a picture of Madison Grant, who doesn’t look very stereotypically Nordic – and rather somewhat Mediterranean, or at least a blend of Nord and Med –
I thought I was being a bit provocative when I said “lecherous Med” in the other thread, but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?
No, it isn’t all about women, Blake.
“None of the Nordish preservationists here has called for throwing the other Whites to the wolves, so to speak, following victory. I think we all agree that we should work together to secure a greater territory for all Whites.”
You mean that after victory your going to restart hostilities?
Seriously? I think there would be some practical problems with that, especially relating to the need to reassert some measure of economic stability.
“Policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation would follow after this greater territory is secured. ”
This could bleed into genocide if it isn’t done right. Making it harder or perhaps even impossible for Nordish and Non-Nordish Whites to get married, and refusing to give Pro-Natalalist subsides to the mothers of those children, would be reasonable due to how it would also serve the end of preserving Non-Nordish Subraces.
However, any attempt to put Non-Nordish Whites at a reproductive disadvantage relative to Nordish Whites would be completely and totally unacceptable. That would be the Subracial equivalent of Cuckoldry, you’d be taking wealth from insufficiently Nordish Whites and using it to subsidize the production of Nordish children.
This would greatly harm the genetic interests of Non-Nordish Whites.
“but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?”
Don’t flatter yourself, Inga.
My statement related to how you’re trying to have things both ways, in a way that would give Nordics an unfair advantage over other Whites.
You can’t try to hold onto Nordic women and then turn around and start invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites by absorbing French bloodlines that are actually more Mediterranean than Nordic.
French, and sufficiently part French, Women are actually much more valuable to Mediterraneans than Nordic Women would be, because they’re close enough that widespread and sustained mixing could occur without having to worry that useful subracial traits and gene complexes would be lost in a meaningful way.
Also there’s the issue that I don’t want every Mediterranean to become too much like Nordics. You tend strongly to take individualism too far, you tend to take the empowerment of Wives over their Husbands too far, you seem to alternate between being too bloodthirsty and too cowardly.
In conclusion: Keep your pillaging Viking paws off Zooey Deschanel, you damn dirty Nordic.
You can’t try to hold onto Nordic women and then turn around and start invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites by absorbing French bloodlines that are actually more Mediterranean than Nordic.
French, and sufficiently part French, Women are actually much more valuable to Mediterraneans than Nordic Women would be, because they’re close enough that widespread and sustained mixing could occur without having to worry that useful subracial traits and gene complexes would be lost in a meaningful way.
Well, this certainly could be a problem, Reg, if attractive, desirable Mediterranean White women (such as the French) are arbitrarily ‘Nordicised’ so as to be taken away from their respective su-racial gene pools.
As well, Nordic women are not always the pinnacle of looks and femininity — often, especially in this day-and-age, quite far from it.
I am familiar with the Brunn-Borreby argument, but respectfully disagree with it. This is essentially Nordicising the old Atlanto-Med indigenous population to fit a political rather than a true anthropological understanding of British population genetics.
The same could be said about those with a political agenda who “Medicise” the indigenous population.
The same could be said about those with a political agenda who “Medicise” the indigenous population.
Not in this case, Blake.
Look, I understand what McCulloch is trying to accomplish – and I like and respect him personally – but he is no anthropologist, and is in fact ‘Nordicising’ a good deal of people who are indeed of non-Nordic origin to make a very tenuous claim that Great Britain is ‘100% Nordish’.
Are you going to deny that he obviously is emphatically not ‘100% Nordic’ or ‘Nordish’ even, based on his phenotype??
Reginald,
Who said anything about “hostilities”? There are many possible policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation that don’t have to be hostile at all to non-Nordish Whites. For example, after a greater White territory is secured, the territory could be carved up into several ethnostates.
And I never advocated “invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites.” You can have all those hirsute beauties to yourself.
Incidentally, according to Wikipedia, Zooey Deschanel is half Irish and half French. She might be more Nordish than Med.
Incidentally, according to Wikipedia, Zooey Deschanel is half Irish and half French. She might be more Nordish than Med.
This is why this whole ‘debate’ is self-defeatingly foolish. Most all Europeans have varying amounts of Nordic, Alpine and Mediterranean ancestry — the differences are in degrees rather than in kind — and getting into genetic ‘witchhunts’ is going to be a ‘Phyrric victory’ – at best – even if ‘Nordicists’ were to get their dreamed-of ‘New Vikingland’.
Again Blake, you didn’t answer my question: Do you think in the picture of Madison Grant above, that he really is representative of an unmixed Nordic?
Also Blake, you really should cut the disrespectful snark out that you are showing to other Whites, ‘Med’ or not.
Remember, after all, that you are not exactly a Swede, Norwegian or Icelander yourself, so there is an excellent chance that you have some of those “hirsute” beauties in your family line as well.
Be proud of all your ancestors ;}
Landser,
If you want respect, you should consider showing some yourself rather than disrespectfully deriding and mocking the perfectly legitimate and good cause of Nordish preservation as being about “witchhunts,” a “Phyrric victory,” “New Vikingland,” etc.
Remember, after all, that you are not exactly a Swede, Norwegian or Icelander yourself, so there is an excellent chance that you have some of those “hirsute” beauties in your family line as well.
Be proud of all your ancestors ;}
I’m phenotypically Nordic, and I wouldn’t be out of place among any of those populations. Anyway, this argument isn’t even legitimate. It’s just like the PC race-mixing propaganda about how we’re all originally from Africa so races don’t really exist and race-mixing is ok.
You tend strongly to take individualism too far, you tend to take the empowerment of Wives over their Husbands too far, you seem to alternate between being too bloodthirsty and too cowardly.
In conclusion: Keep your pillaging Viking paws off Zooey Deschanel, you damn dirty Nordic.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?
Landser,
I’m confused when you say you disagree with the “Brünn/Borreby argument” and accuse McCulloch of “Nordicising” these people, when UP types are not Nordic. You rightfully warn others against interchangeably using the words Nordic and Nordish, and yet you seem to be doing just that in your post above.
McCulloch’s physical anthropology is based primarily on Coon, but also informed by many other credible sources as well: Woltmann, Hooton, Ripley, Günther, etc. Overall, I believe he is on solid ground in this arena more often than not.
Surely you don’t deny the very existence of the Upper Paleolithic/Cro-Magnoid race types? The UP elements are quite phenotypically distinct from their Nordic and Atlanto-Mediterranean countrymen. Take a look at these two Irishmen, both of whom are from Clare: this one is distinctly Keltic Nordic, while this one is a Brünn. Compare both of them to Pierce Brosnan, a good example of a North Atlantid Irishman. None of these three should to be confused with the classical Hallstatt Nordic racial type, of which Max von Sydow is an excellent representative.
The Brünn type, which is markedly different in appearance from both KN and Atlantid types, accounts for approximately 50% of the racial composition of Ireland according to Dr. Carleton Coon. I am not denying that there is a significant Atlanto-Mediterranean presence in the British Isles, but this migration took place during the mesolithic period, quite a long time after the remnants of the Upper Paleolithic hunters had already settled the area. If you have research that contradicts this widely held anthropological premise, I am very interested to hear it.
It’s always a pleasure speaking with you as well, Herr Landser.
It saddens me that so many here seem incapable of discussing these issues without becoming overly emotional and lashing out at one another. I think the impersonal, abstract nature of discourse on the internet is largely responsible for this. While engaged in actual folk-building in the real world, I never encounter such problems.
All of my WN friends know the way I feel about Nordish preservationism, and none of them have ever expressed any concern about it. I respect their viewpoint and they respect mine.The idea that I would try to exclude a close comrade, such as Michael Bell for example, from a future White ethnostate, simply because he has some Italian blood, is something that would never even occur to either of us; it is prima facie absurd.
Conversely, any mention of Nordish preservationism on the internet is likely to be met by accusations of genocidal Nordic Supremacism. I am aware of the fact that some internet trolls do use Nordicism to sow division and insult other WNs, but I do not, and no serious Nordish preservationist I know would engage in such behaviour. Some Christians do the same thing to Heathens, and vice versa, but does that render either religion as an illegitimate spiritual path?
It sure would be nice if we could get rid of the cranks and have civilised discussions on these matters.
Blake,
No, I am reacting to needless and gratuitous disrespect that you have showed to good, decent White people of Mediterranean descent with your silly comments about ‘lecherous Meds’ and ‘hirsute’ beauties.
What’s the matter with you man – did you get picked on by ‘Eye-talians’ growing up or something? Or, better yet, do you think you ‘know them’ by watching too much ‘Talmudvision’ or something?
And I stand by what I said before: If you are of British descent – then you indeed come from a Nordic-Mediterranean gene pool – regardless of what YOU may personally look like… and regardless of you conflating that with ‘pc race-mixing propaganda’ and the ‘African origins’ myth.
Robert,
I think we are in agreemant overall, just that we may be misunderstanding some of the terms used.
And thank you for being a gentleman about the whole thing, and being polite and respectful about it all.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?
Not only does he want to live with us, but he also wants to impose Med/Semitic folkways such as polygamy that are alien to us and repellent to our character and individualism.
This could bleed into genocide if it isn’t done right.
We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
Twisting this into lurid speculation of “genocide” is just what an anti-white leftist would do with respect to white racial preservation.
We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
With all due respect MGLS, this is taking it a bit too extreme. In other words – its 2010, not 1910, and the ‘Med’ population of America is really rather small, and has been a good deal assimilated into the Anglo-mainstream, since the cutoff of the 1924 Immigration Act.
Even McCulloch recognized this, and felt it would, in his words, be ‘quixiotic’ to attempt anything otherwise than to accept all Gentile Europeans into a potential future WHite ethnostate.
No, I am reacting to needless and gratuitous disrespect that you have showed to good, decent White people of Mediterranean descent with your silly comments about ‘lecherous Meds’ and ‘hirsute’ beauties.
I admit that saying “lecherous Meds” was a bit provocative and uncharitable. But my interlocutor’s response to this comment was largely about women. So this issue is in part about women, and even if it was unkind, there is some truth to my original comment. Furthermore, my interlocutor responded with much greater and disproportionate disrespect. Responding with a remark about “hirsute beauties” was quite mild in comparison.
And I stand by what I said before: If you are of British descent – then you indeed come from a Nordic-Mediterranean gene pool – regardless of what YOU may personally look like… and regardless of you conflating that with ‘pc race-mixing propaganda’ and the ‘African origins’ myth.
There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate? – MGLS
Reginald doesn’t ‘despise’ us – it was just that he felt he and his ethnicity were needlessly disrespected – and he acted in kind. That is what these types of ‘more Nordic than thou’ debates tend to produce :/
There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.
Blake,
First off, thank you for elevating your tone.
Secondly, yes there were great Germanic invaders and conquerers of the British Isles – but there’s the rub – they were the elites, who ultimately became the aristocracy and the nobility, where much of the rest of the indigenous population was of pre-Germanic stock – whether they were Med or otherwise.
As well, the continental Germanic/Scandinavian contribution to the overall British gene pool, regardless of country or class, is approximately 20-30% of the national average.
Blake wrote,
“There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.”
Indeed, and there is also the issue of the UP types, which Landser initially rejected but seems to have accepted after my explanation. A lot of people in the British Isles have Mediterranean blood somewhere, sure, but certainly not all of them, and it’s a rather moot argument anyway, as these types are assimilated to the point of being peripheral Nordish and assimilable into the Nordish racial core.
No one is suggesting that Meds are inferior or any nonsense like that. I honestly don’t understand why it offends non-Nordish people when Nordish people want to remain themselves. I want my grandchildren to look like my grandfather, to carry on my unique cultural traditions as a Northern European, and I will never apologise for that.
I am going to start deleting any personal attacks when I see them. This stuff is out of control I am tired of it. Those of you who have been insulting other WNs for the catharsis it provides, using legitimate issues as a pretext to perpetuate interpersonal conflicts: learn to comport yourselves as gentlemen or post elsewhere.
Good stuff Robert.
And yes, I largely agree with you, especially after you explained yourself and clarified your points so well.
Also, I am a Northern European myself, and I want my people’s heritage and way of life preserved as well… no apologies necessary.
My overall point in regards to the British Isles is that the Nordic and the gracile, Atlanto-Med and UP types assimilated rather well together indeed into the great nation that we now know as Great Britain, along with their diaspora peoples, such as the Americans.
I feel this process is happening here as well, in White America today – where just as the Meds, UP’s and other non-Nordics of Britain assimilated with their Nordic and Germanic neighbors – the same can, as well, happen here with us today.
“If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us?”
Nordicists seem to take a very simplistic view of things.
If I’m interested in what the requirement for merely getting a passport into Nordistan is, not even mentioning the issue of intermarriage, that means I must be driven by the simplistic motive of lusting after Nordic females.
If I do the exact same thing to Mediterranean Women that the Nordicists were doing with any female with the slightest Nordic ancestry, aggressively assert ownership for the sake of maintaining a Racial Subtype, that means I must be driven by hatred.
(On another thread Mark tried to claim most French as Nordish; which was really just a one sided, expansionist, and pillaging stance to take in the context of the position Nordicists take on the question of whether what they call “Nordish“ Women can breed with Mediterraneans.)
If there’s actually going to be racial separation between Nords and Meds, it is actually more important that the Meds not have our Women stolen, or anything close to our Women stolen, as our numbers in America are dangerously small and we need all the demographic help we can get.
And if your goal is Nordic preservation, you should be utterly overjoyed to have your numbers whittled down to an utterly Non-Med core.
“Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?”
In the long term that may be preferable, but that doesn’t make it wise to jump the gun when there are profound strategic reasons to avoid doing do.
For one thing, the Federal Government still exists.
If Whites start to break down along Subracial or Subethnic lines before the Government is destroyed, it will put Mediterranean Whites in a situation where the Feds will almost certainly concentrate their firepower on the Mediterranean Whites, due to our smaller size and the need to establish bases by which more Nordish Areas can be attacked and infiltrated with Government spies.
It is important to understand that if the Confederate States had been meaningfully disunited into two or three camps, the Civil War would’ve lasted for about two months.
There a very good reason why the phrase “divide and conquer” was first applied to Warfare.
Also, the general principle of Racial Separation in America probably needs to established before the principle of Subracial Seperation could get off the ground, especially with the many Mediterranean Whites who have been assimilated into a more general European cultural context.
“We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
Twisting this into lurid speculation of ‘genocide’ is just what an anti-white leftist would do with respect to white racial preservation.”
There was a nearly genocidal proposal offered on the other thread by Trainspotter, whereby Nordics would be offered Pro-Natality subsidies from the tax payers that would be denied to a certain number of Mediterranean tax payers, and oddly enough nobody saw fit to object to it except a single poster who is against Nordicism.
And the thing is that even if such a program started out only putting Mediterraneans with a small amount of genes that appear Non-European at a comparative reproductive disadvantage, there’s no reason it wouldn’t go further than that, and no reason the genetic test couldn’t be gamed to give Mediterraneans far more false positives of Non-White ancestry.
For example, if you assigned slight Non-European Caucasian admixture an equal weight as slight American Indian and slight Proto-Mongoloid admixture, in spite of Non-European Caucasians being much closer to Whites, this would impose an arbitrary and Proto-Genocidal reproductive burden on Meds.
Robert Campbell,
“A lot of people in the British Isles have Mediterranean blood somewhere, sure, but certainly not all of them, and it’s a rather moot argument anyway, as these types are assimilated to the point of being peripheral Nordish and assailable into the Nordish racial core.”
That’s part of the problem with Nordics, they have a history of engorging themselves on other subraces without there being reciprocity.
Besides the important issue of this reducing diversity needlessly, this also has the effect of victimizing the other races on a genetic level.
If two races are to be turned into one, it must be done in such a way as to respect the genetic interests of both races.
That is NOT what the Anglo-Saxons did to the Britons. That is NOT what some Vikings did to certain parts of Russia. That is NOT what some other Vikings did to an extreme northern part of France.
And truth be told this was not what the National Socialists would’ve done to the Russians, had they won that conflict.
That’s part of the problem with Nordics, they have a history of engorging themselves on other subraces without there being reciprocity.
No. Our problem is inviting in aliens and allowing them to take over our societies.
“Engorging” ourselves? What are you talking about?
Reciprocity? It really is about Nordic females, isn’t it?
Besides the important issue of this reducing diversity needlessly, this also has the effect of victimizing the other races on a genetic level.
Wow. Now you’re just blatantly using the Left’s anti-White arguments against us. So now “diversity is strength” and we’re “victimizing the other races”?
If two races are to be turned into one, it must be done in such a way as to respect the genetic interests of both races.
Who said anything about mixing? That is completely antithetical to our goal of Nordish preservation.
“Reciprocity? It really is about Nordic females, isn’t it?”
In any scheme where the Men of Tribe A are allowed access to ANY of the Women of Tribe B, the only way to prevent the genes of Tribe B being replaced is for the Men of Tribe B to be allowed access to the Women of Tribe A.
This is reciprocity.
While this has the serious downside of diluting both races, at least their respective gene level inclusive fitness will be respected.
You won’t have the genes of one Tribe replacing the genes of the other.
Robert Campbell described as some kind of good thing cases in History where Nordics used the technique of unreciprocated subrace mixing to wipe out massive numbers of Non-Nordic White genes.
This is very disturbing to me.
“Wow. Now you’re just blatantly using the Left’s anti-White arguments against us. So now ‘diversity is strength’ and we’re ‘victimizing the other races‘?”
Taking the view that the destruction of Intra-White Genetic Diversity is a bad thing hardly amounts to an inherently Leftist argument.
It is merely an Anti-Genocidalist argument.
“…and we’re ‘victimizing the other races‘?”
I was speaking of certain undeniable events that occurred in the past, and which constitute a pattern of Nordic evolutionary strategy. Thankfully you aren’t currently victimizing other subraces of Whites.
“Who said anything about mixing? That is completely antithetical to our goal of Nordish preservation.”
You’ve defined the term Nordish so loosely that it certainly will lead to mixing, and in the context of a Nordic dominated Nordish Ethnostate, this will almost certainly lead to the large scale replacement of Non-Nordic Genes by Nordic Genes.
Robert Campbell described as some kind of good thing cases in History where Nordics used the technique of unreciprocated subrace mixing to wipe out massive numbers of Non-Nordic White genes.
Well, “good” obviously depends on perspective and identity here.
Taking the view that the destruction of Intra-White Genetic Diversity is a bad thing hardly amounts to an inherently Leftist argument.
It is merely an Anti-Genocidalist argument.
None of the Nordish preservationists here is advocating the genocide of non-Nordish Whites and the destruction of intra-White genetic diversity. Nordish preservation is the preservation of intra-White genetic diversity. Those who are against Nordish preservation and seek to impede it are the ones who aim to destroy intra-White genetic diversity and are genocidalist. None of us is clamoring for access to Med females.
Thankfully you aren’t currently victimizing other subraces of Whites.
We’re currently being victimized by other subraces of Whites.
You’ve defined the term Nordish so loosely that it certainly will lead to mixing, and in the context of a Nordic dominated Nordish Ethnostate, this will almost certainly lead to the large scale replacement of Non-Nordic Genes by Nordic Genes.
It can be clarified and refined. At any rate, within a Nordish ethnostate, I don’t see why the replacement would be a problem. That would be part of the point.
The Western British have no close or special relationship to Iberians, much less other “Meds”.
Madison Grant is 100% Northwestern European. Nor does he look remotely “Med”; but if he did it would be irrelevant. British “Atlanto-Meds” are no more closely related to Italians or Greeks than are British Nordics.
The French cluster genetically with other West/Central Europeans. PCA and MDS plots show minimal overlap between the French and the Spanish or Italians. As one would expect based on geography, some French will be more similar to Northern Italians or Spaniards. But on the whole, the French tend to be more similar to Germans and Brits.
Racially, Northwestern Europeans form a coherent group. “Meds” do not.
Visualize concentric circles radiating out from Great Britain on plots like the one linked above (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ro2ijOk8JWc/SLs7sALkwoI/AAAAAAAAATs/sa2Ig1gv31M/s1600-h/novembre.jpg), and it should be clear that it’s perfectly reasonable for Northwestern Europeans concerned with racial preservation to define their ingroup in ways which, for example, include the French and exclude Southern Italians.
Draw concentric circles around Greece, and you’ll include much of the Middle East before you ever get to France.
Reginald’s assertion that Northern European preservationists want to “grab French women for themselves” is bizarre and tends to support blake’s assessment of his motives. It would of course make no sense from the standpoint of racial preservation to include French women but exclude French men in a proposed state. We can infer that Reginald is not French but believes he has a right to French women (or half-French, half-Irish women, as the case may be).
Good background music! that’s from Halloween III, Season of the Witch, which is about getting millions of children to don special Halloween masks that are implanted with a chip. The TV instructs the children to put on the masks, and the TV sets off a signal to make the masks detonate and kill off millions of kids all at once. It’s a John Carpenter movie, the same director who made “They Live.”
I thought Halloween III was pretty good. It features an Irish owned costume company planning the mass killings via mask in order to celebrate Samhain and revive the ancient Celtic gods.
I wonder if the idea originally centered around something closer to the truth, and they were forced to make it “Irish” in order to get it made?
John Carpenter is incredibly talented, he created that score, even though he can’t read or write a note.
I like that he relies on suspense and mood rather than excessive gore, which you see too much of today.
He has a unique style that I’ve always enjoyed, some other greats by Carpenter:
They Live
Big Trouble in Little China
The Fog
Escape from New York
The Thing
Christine
Starman
Prince of Darkness
I think it could gain wider distribution if the closing credits did not feature a Swastika. Someone else said somewhere recently that either you think the swastika is inherently evil, or you think it is a one of the oldest sacred symbols of the European. If you are in the latter category it should be kept in a cherished space away from those who would do it harm.
I think it could gain wider distribution if the closing credits did not feature a Swastika. Someone else said somewhere recently that either you think the swastika is inherently evil, or you think it is a one of the oldest sacred symbols of the European. If you are in the latter category it should be kept in a cherished space away from those who would do it harm.
Although I agree the Hakenkreuz should not be shown or used flippantly, especially by hollyweird ‘kostume nazis’ – I feel it is gratuitously insulting to the memory of the brave German and other European soldiers (AND civilians) to whom that symbol meant something, actually a great deal – sacrificing so much fighting the Red Soviet hordes and protecting Europa from the scourge of Asiatic bolshevism.
Jackson,
I agree. The Swastika and the “White Power” message were overly harsh, and I wish they weren’t included, but I thought the video was good enough to post anyway. You echo my own feelings on the subject, which were well expressed by Jost Turner:
“The Swastika is the most sacred symbol of our Folk (and as well, of all mankind who strive to live in harmony with Nature). Never flaunt it! Never render it with specious words or with thoughtless, childish racial slurs! Keep it sacred and singular by sheltering it from the eyes of mankind’s enemies until the day comes when all will gaze on it with honor and reverence!”
Better be careful fellas speaking objectively of National Socialism — or else Jackson might just start posting pictures of the Red hordes storming the Reichstag.
When I first started watching this video, it looked like a Greenpeace promo; it took 3:20 to get to the racialist message. But upon reflection, I can see how this video could be used to racialize white environmental activists. That’s a narrow demographic, but if you think you can do it, have at it.
I personally have a difficult time abiding the company of environmentalists. They remind me too much of anti-racists in their attitudes and mannerisms. They all talk and act like Red Jeffrey.
Found on the net:
TFH April 14, 2010 at 23:23
I strongly believe in free markets and small government.
I stopped voting Republican when I discovered that a Republican/conservative will support any and all leftism that can be packaged as ‘chivalry’. Hence, Republicans have expanded the state just as quickly as Democrats have, even though Republicans *think* they haven’t.
There is no right-wing possible without an accurate understanding of the female brain. At the moment, there is thus no real right-wing in America.
Another Avenue to Prosecute Skeptics
April 11, 2010, 10:33 am At the United Nations, whose general hostility to free speech is fairly well established, a proposal is on the table to allow the prosecution of people, like myself, who publicly disagree with the UN’s position on climate science:
The proposal for the United Nations to accept “ecocide” as a fifth “crime against peace”, which could be tried at the International Criminal Court (ICC), is the brainchild of British lawyer-turned-campaigner Polly Higgins.
The radical idea would have a profound effect on industries blamed for widespread damage to the environment like fossil fuels, mining, agriculture, chemicals and forestry.
Supporters of a new ecocide law also believe it could be used to prosecute “climate deniers” who distort science and facts to discourage voters and politicians from taking action to tackle global warming and climate change.
Joel Kotkin (Jew) wrote an article entitled “America in 2050 — Strength in Diversity” which was rather widely syndicated; here is the opening:
“An ongoing source of strength for the United States over the next 40 years will be its openness to immigration. Indeed, more than most of its chief global rivals, the U.S. will be reshaped and re-energized by an increasing racial and ethnic diversity.”
Jewish behavior and thought-processes are empirically predictable once you know what to look for.
It goes without saying that at the bottom of the article is a Google ad (Google = Jewish owned/managed company) for an interracial dating service featuring a White man with a Black woman – http://www.InterracialRomance.com
I suppose it would help if I included a link to Jew Kotkin’s article: http://www.newgeography.com/content/001466-america-2050-strength-diversity — it’s from about a month ago.
Jew Kotkin is the author of the book The Next Hundred Million, which celebrates a hypothetical future in which the 21st Century USA has been flooded by 100+ million non-White immigrants.
I say we send “The Next Hundred Million [non-Whites]” to Kotkin’s Israel! It is only fair compensation for all the American Jews have done for us, no?
I personally have a difficult time abiding the company of environmentalists. They remind me too much of anti-racists in their attitudes and mannerisms. They all talk and act like Red Jeffrey.
When it should be the opposite. Racialism and environmentalism were once linked, and non-whites are much less responsible and concerned about the environment and animals.
Mark: “When it should be the opposite. Racialism and environmentalism were once linked, and non-whites are much less responsible and concerned about the environment and animals.”
I absolutely agree with this statement! 🙂
Indeed, Mark!
Those who loathe Nordicists so much (ahem, Matt), and believe they have no place within the American racialist tradition, should remember that we wouldn’t have any redwood trees remaining if it wasn’t for Madison Grant.
We wouldn’t have the National Park system (my favourite thing about this country) if it weren’t for Teddy Roosevelt.
Nordic-determined White men have done damn fine by the “American Tribe” if you ask me.
Well, please don’t conflate ‘Nordic’ with ‘Nordish’ – since they are not necessarily one and the same thing.
Remember, the indigenous White inhabitants of the British Isles are Atlanto-Mediterranean, and this genetic type is still strongly represented in all the countries of the UK – albeit mixed with Nordic elements. (*Remember also as well that the continental Germanic genetic admixture of the Isles is no more than 20-30%.)
Just look at Madison Grant himself.
Landser,
I am quite aware that they are not the same thing, and I didn’t imply otherwise.
If you are confused because I usually refer to myself as a Nordish preservationist, while I’ve dubbed Grant a Nordicist, that was deliberate. The word Nordish had not been coined in Grant’s time, and he was an unabashed Nordicist.
Much like Dr. Hans F.K. Günther, Grant believed that any serious anthropological assessment of history resulted in a Nordic-determined, even Nordic supremacist, position.
Your assertion that the British Isles were, and are, predominantly Mediterranean is incorrect. The aborigines of Northwestern Europe are the descendants of partially depigmented Upper Paleolithic survivors of the last Ice Age: Brünn and Borreby.
Here is McCulloch’s analysis of the subject, based primarily on Coon’s research:
He estimates the distribution of racial types among the indigenous British population as follows:
“Nordic-determined White men have done damn fine by the ‘American Tribe’ if you ask me.”
Robert Campbell,
They weren’t advocating the creation of an all White State for Nordics, while planning to leave the other Whites to fend for themselves in areas of the Country that would be dominated by Non-Whites.
They didn’t try to grab most of the French Women for themselves, wrongly pretending they’re closer to Nordics than to Mediterraneans, while hypocritically telling Mediterranean Whites to stay away from their Women.
They weren’t advocating the creation of an all White State for Nordics, while planning to leave the other Whites to fend for themselves in areas of the Country that would be dominated by Non-Whites.
None of the Nordish preservationists here has called for throwing the other Whites to the wolves, so to speak, following victory. I think we all agree that we should work together to secure a greater territory for all Whites. Policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation would follow after this greater territory is secured. So there’s no reason why the other Whites would be imperiled by non-Whites.
They didn’t try to grab most of the French Women for themselves, wrongly pretending they’re closer to Nordics than to Mediterraneans, while hypocritically telling Mediterranean Whites to stay away from their Women.
I thought I was being a bit provocative when I said “lecherous Med” in the other thread, but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?
Your assertion that the British Isles were, and are, predominantly Mediterranean is incorrect. The aborigines of Northwestern Europe are the descendants of partially depigmented Upper Paleolithic survivors of the last Ice Age: Brünn and Borreby.
Robert,
Hi, thanks for the response.
Don’t misunderstand me, I am not at all saying that the British Isles is predominantly Mediterranean. What I am saying is that the aboriginal White population was Atlanto-Mediterranean, who amalgamated with the conquering Nordics and produced the British as we know them today — a people with varying degrees of Nordic and Mediterranean in their national gene pool.
I am familiar with the Brunn-Borreby argument, but respectfully disagree with it. This is essentially Nordicising the old Atlanto-Med indigenous population to fit a political rather than a true anthropological understanding of British population genetics.
As well, here is a picture of Madison Grant, who doesn’t look very stereotypically Nordic – and rather somewhat Mediterranean, or at least a blend of Nord and Med –
http://www.amren.com/ar/1997/12/MadisonGrant.gif
Always nice speaking with you, Robert.
I thought I was being a bit provocative when I said “lecherous Med” in the other thread, but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?
No, it isn’t all about women, Blake.
“None of the Nordish preservationists here has called for throwing the other Whites to the wolves, so to speak, following victory. I think we all agree that we should work together to secure a greater territory for all Whites.”
You mean that after victory your going to restart hostilities?
Seriously? I think there would be some practical problems with that, especially relating to the need to reassert some measure of economic stability.
“Policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation would follow after this greater territory is secured. ”
This could bleed into genocide if it isn’t done right. Making it harder or perhaps even impossible for Nordish and Non-Nordish Whites to get married, and refusing to give Pro-Natalalist subsides to the mothers of those children, would be reasonable due to how it would also serve the end of preserving Non-Nordish Subraces.
However, any attempt to put Non-Nordish Whites at a reproductive disadvantage relative to Nordish Whites would be completely and totally unacceptable. That would be the Subracial equivalent of Cuckoldry, you’d be taking wealth from insufficiently Nordish Whites and using it to subsidize the production of Nordish children.
This would greatly harm the genetic interests of Non-Nordish Whites.
“but it really is about Nordic women, isn’t it?”
Don’t flatter yourself, Inga.
My statement related to how you’re trying to have things both ways, in a way that would give Nordics an unfair advantage over other Whites.
You can’t try to hold onto Nordic women and then turn around and start invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites by absorbing French bloodlines that are actually more Mediterranean than Nordic.
French, and sufficiently part French, Women are actually much more valuable to Mediterraneans than Nordic Women would be, because they’re close enough that widespread and sustained mixing could occur without having to worry that useful subracial traits and gene complexes would be lost in a meaningful way.
Also there’s the issue that I don’t want every Mediterranean to become too much like Nordics. You tend strongly to take individualism too far, you tend to take the empowerment of Wives over their Husbands too far, you seem to alternate between being too bloodthirsty and too cowardly.
In conclusion: Keep your pillaging Viking paws off Zooey Deschanel, you damn dirty Nordic.
You can’t try to hold onto Nordic women and then turn around and start invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites by absorbing French bloodlines that are actually more Mediterranean than Nordic.
French, and sufficiently part French, Women are actually much more valuable to Mediterraneans than Nordic Women would be, because they’re close enough that widespread and sustained mixing could occur without having to worry that useful subracial traits and gene complexes would be lost in a meaningful way.
Well, this certainly could be a problem, Reg, if attractive, desirable Mediterranean White women (such as the French) are arbitrarily ‘Nordicised’ so as to be taken away from their respective su-racial gene pools.
As well, Nordic women are not always the pinnacle of looks and femininity — often, especially in this day-and-age, quite far from it.
I am familiar with the Brunn-Borreby argument, but respectfully disagree with it. This is essentially Nordicising the old Atlanto-Med indigenous population to fit a political rather than a true anthropological understanding of British population genetics.
The same could be said about those with a political agenda who “Medicise” the indigenous population.
The same could be said about those with a political agenda who “Medicise” the indigenous population.
Not in this case, Blake.
Look, I understand what McCulloch is trying to accomplish – and I like and respect him personally – but he is no anthropologist, and is in fact ‘Nordicising’ a good deal of people who are indeed of non-Nordic origin to make a very tenuous claim that Great Britain is ‘100% Nordish’.
Again, here is Madison Grant –
http://www.amren.com/ar/1997/12/MadisonGrant.gif
Are you going to deny that he obviously is emphatically not ‘100% Nordic’ or ‘Nordish’ even, based on his phenotype??
Reginald,
Who said anything about “hostilities”? There are many possible policies and measures to ensure Nordish preservation that don’t have to be hostile at all to non-Nordish Whites. For example, after a greater White territory is secured, the territory could be carved up into several ethnostates.
And I never advocated “invading the genetic space of Mediterranean Whites.” You can have all those hirsute beauties to yourself.
Incidentally, according to Wikipedia, Zooey Deschanel is half Irish and half French. She might be more Nordish than Med.
Incidentally, according to Wikipedia, Zooey Deschanel is half Irish and half French. She might be more Nordish than Med.
This is why this whole ‘debate’ is self-defeatingly foolish. Most all Europeans have varying amounts of Nordic, Alpine and Mediterranean ancestry — the differences are in degrees rather than in kind — and getting into genetic ‘witchhunts’ is going to be a ‘Phyrric victory’ – at best – even if ‘Nordicists’ were to get their dreamed-of ‘New Vikingland’.
Again Blake, you didn’t answer my question: Do you think in the picture of Madison Grant above, that he really is representative of an unmixed Nordic?
Also Blake, you really should cut the disrespectful snark out that you are showing to other Whites, ‘Med’ or not.
Remember, after all, that you are not exactly a Swede, Norwegian or Icelander yourself, so there is an excellent chance that you have some of those “hirsute” beauties in your family line as well.
Be proud of all your ancestors ;}
Landser,
If you want respect, you should consider showing some yourself rather than disrespectfully deriding and mocking the perfectly legitimate and good cause of Nordish preservation as being about “witchhunts,” a “Phyrric victory,” “New Vikingland,” etc.
Remember, after all, that you are not exactly a Swede, Norwegian or Icelander yourself, so there is an excellent chance that you have some of those “hirsute” beauties in your family line as well.
Be proud of all your ancestors ;}
I’m phenotypically Nordic, and I wouldn’t be out of place among any of those populations. Anyway, this argument isn’t even legitimate. It’s just like the PC race-mixing propaganda about how we’re all originally from Africa so races don’t really exist and race-mixing is ok.
You tend strongly to take individualism too far, you tend to take the empowerment of Wives over their Husbands too far, you seem to alternate between being too bloodthirsty and too cowardly.
In conclusion: Keep your pillaging Viking paws off Zooey Deschanel, you damn dirty Nordic.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?
Landser,
I’m confused when you say you disagree with the “Brünn/Borreby argument” and accuse McCulloch of “Nordicising” these people, when UP types are not Nordic. You rightfully warn others against interchangeably using the words Nordic and Nordish, and yet you seem to be doing just that in your post above.
McCulloch’s physical anthropology is based primarily on Coon, but also informed by many other credible sources as well: Woltmann, Hooton, Ripley, Günther, etc. Overall, I believe he is on solid ground in this arena more often than not.
Surely you don’t deny the very existence of the Upper Paleolithic/Cro-Magnoid race types? The UP elements are quite phenotypically distinct from their Nordic and Atlanto-Mediterranean countrymen. Take a look at these two Irishmen, both of whom are from Clare: this one is distinctly Keltic Nordic, while this one is a Brünn. Compare both of them to Pierce Brosnan, a good example of a North Atlantid Irishman. None of these three should to be confused with the classical Hallstatt Nordic racial type, of which Max von Sydow is an excellent representative.
The Brünn type, which is markedly different in appearance from both KN and Atlantid types, accounts for approximately 50% of the racial composition of Ireland according to Dr. Carleton Coon. I am not denying that there is a significant Atlanto-Mediterranean presence in the British Isles, but this migration took place during the mesolithic period, quite a long time after the remnants of the Upper Paleolithic hunters had already settled the area. If you have research that contradicts this widely held anthropological premise, I am very interested to hear it.
It’s always a pleasure speaking with you as well, Herr Landser.
It saddens me that so many here seem incapable of discussing these issues without becoming overly emotional and lashing out at one another. I think the impersonal, abstract nature of discourse on the internet is largely responsible for this. While engaged in actual folk-building in the real world, I never encounter such problems.
All of my WN friends know the way I feel about Nordish preservationism, and none of them have ever expressed any concern about it. I respect their viewpoint and they respect mine.The idea that I would try to exclude a close comrade, such as Michael Bell for example, from a future White ethnostate, simply because he has some Italian blood, is something that would never even occur to either of us; it is prima facie absurd.
Conversely, any mention of Nordish preservationism on the internet is likely to be met by accusations of genocidal Nordic Supremacism. I am aware of the fact that some internet trolls do use Nordicism to sow division and insult other WNs, but I do not, and no serious Nordish preservationist I know would engage in such behaviour. Some Christians do the same thing to Heathens, and vice versa, but does that render either religion as an illegitimate spiritual path?
It sure would be nice if we could get rid of the cranks and have civilised discussions on these matters.
Blake,
No, I am reacting to needless and gratuitous disrespect that you have showed to good, decent White people of Mediterranean descent with your silly comments about ‘lecherous Meds’ and ‘hirsute’ beauties.
What’s the matter with you man – did you get picked on by ‘Eye-talians’ growing up or something? Or, better yet, do you think you ‘know them’ by watching too much ‘Talmudvision’ or something?
And I stand by what I said before: If you are of British descent – then you indeed come from a Nordic-Mediterranean gene pool – regardless of what YOU may personally look like… and regardless of you conflating that with ‘pc race-mixing propaganda’ and the ‘African origins’ myth.
Robert,
I think we are in agreemant overall, just that we may be misunderstanding some of the terms used.
And thank you for being a gentleman about the whole thing, and being polite and respectful about it all.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?
Not only does he want to live with us, but he also wants to impose Med/Semitic folkways such as polygamy that are alien to us and repellent to our character and individualism.
This could bleed into genocide if it isn’t done right.
We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
Twisting this into lurid speculation of “genocide” is just what an anti-white leftist would do with respect to white racial preservation.
We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
With all due respect MGLS, this is taking it a bit too extreme. In other words – its 2010, not 1910, and the ‘Med’ population of America is really rather small, and has been a good deal assimilated into the Anglo-mainstream, since the cutoff of the 1924 Immigration Act.
Even McCulloch recognized this, and felt it would, in his words, be ‘quixiotic’ to attempt anything otherwise than to accept all Gentile Europeans into a potential future WHite ethnostate.
No, I am reacting to needless and gratuitous disrespect that you have showed to good, decent White people of Mediterranean descent with your silly comments about ‘lecherous Meds’ and ‘hirsute’ beauties.
I admit that saying “lecherous Meds” was a bit provocative and uncharitable. But my interlocutor’s response to this comment was largely about women. So this issue is in part about women, and even if it was unkind, there is some truth to my original comment. Furthermore, my interlocutor responded with much greater and disproportionate disrespect. Responding with a remark about “hirsute beauties” was quite mild in comparison.
And I stand by what I said before: If you are of British descent – then you indeed come from a Nordic-Mediterranean gene pool – regardless of what YOU may personally look like… and regardless of you conflating that with ‘pc race-mixing propaganda’ and the ‘African origins’ myth.
There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.
If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us? Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate? – MGLS
Reginald doesn’t ‘despise’ us – it was just that he felt he and his ethnicity were needlessly disrespected – and he acted in kind. That is what these types of ‘more Nordic than thou’ debates tend to produce :/
There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.
Blake,
First off, thank you for elevating your tone.
Secondly, yes there were great Germanic invaders and conquerers of the British Isles – but there’s the rub – they were the elites, who ultimately became the aristocracy and the nobility, where much of the rest of the indigenous population was of pre-Germanic stock – whether they were Med or otherwise.
As well, the continental Germanic/Scandinavian contribution to the overall British gene pool, regardless of country or class, is approximately 20-30% of the national average.
Blake wrote,
“There were great Continental and Scandinavian migrations and invasions into the British Isles. To suggest that all those of English extraction, specifically of Anglo-Saxon composition and with ancestral roots in the East of England, definitively have non-trivial or significant Med admixture is incorrect.”
Indeed, and there is also the issue of the UP types, which Landser initially rejected but seems to have accepted after my explanation. A lot of people in the British Isles have Mediterranean blood somewhere, sure, but certainly not all of them, and it’s a rather moot argument anyway, as these types are assimilated to the point of being peripheral Nordish and assimilable into the Nordish racial core.
No one is suggesting that Meds are inferior or any nonsense like that. I honestly don’t understand why it offends non-Nordish people when Nordish people want to remain themselves. I want my grandchildren to look like my grandfather, to carry on my unique cultural traditions as a Northern European, and I will never apologise for that.
I am going to start deleting any personal attacks when I see them. This stuff is out of control I am tired of it. Those of you who have been insulting other WNs for the catharsis it provides, using legitimate issues as a pretext to perpetuate interpersonal conflicts: learn to comport yourselves as gentlemen or post elsewhere.
Good stuff Robert.
And yes, I largely agree with you, especially after you explained yourself and clarified your points so well.
Also, I am a Northern European myself, and I want my people’s heritage and way of life preserved as well… no apologies necessary.
My overall point in regards to the British Isles is that the Nordic and the gracile, Atlanto-Med and UP types assimilated rather well together indeed into the great nation that we now know as Great Britain, along with their diaspora peoples, such as the Americans.
I feel this process is happening here as well, in White America today – where just as the Meds, UP’s and other non-Nordics of Britain assimilated with their Nordic and Germanic neighbors – the same can, as well, happen here with us today.
“If you despise us so much, why do you want to live with us?”
Nordicists seem to take a very simplistic view of things.
If I’m interested in what the requirement for merely getting a passport into Nordistan is, not even mentioning the issue of intermarriage, that means I must be driven by the simplistic motive of lusting after Nordic females.
If I do the exact same thing to Mediterranean Women that the Nordicists were doing with any female with the slightest Nordic ancestry, aggressively assert ownership for the sake of maintaining a Racial Subtype, that means I must be driven by hatred.
(On another thread Mark tried to claim most French as Nordish; which was really just a one sided, expansionist, and pillaging stance to take in the context of the position Nordicists take on the question of whether what they call “Nordish“ Women can breed with Mediterraneans.)
If there’s actually going to be racial separation between Nords and Meds, it is actually more important that the Meds not have our Women stolen, or anything close to our Women stolen, as our numbers in America are dangerously small and we need all the demographic help we can get.
And if your goal is Nordic preservation, you should be utterly overjoyed to have your numbers whittled down to an utterly Non-Med core.
“Would you not rather be separate and have your own ethnostate?”
In the long term that may be preferable, but that doesn’t make it wise to jump the gun when there are profound strategic reasons to avoid doing do.
For one thing, the Federal Government still exists.
If Whites start to break down along Subracial or Subethnic lines before the Government is destroyed, it will put Mediterranean Whites in a situation where the Feds will almost certainly concentrate their firepower on the Mediterranean Whites, due to our smaller size and the need to establish bases by which more Nordish Areas can be attacked and infiltrated with Government spies.
It is important to understand that if the Confederate States had been meaningfully disunited into two or three camps, the Civil War would’ve lasted for about two months.
There a very good reason why the phrase “divide and conquer” was first applied to Warfare.
Also, the general principle of Racial Separation in America probably needs to established before the principle of Subracial Seperation could get off the ground, especially with the many Mediterranean Whites who have been assimilated into a more general European cultural context.
“We’re talking about preservation and separation: a Nordish ethnostate and a Mediterranean ethnostate.
Twisting this into lurid speculation of ‘genocide’ is just what an anti-white leftist would do with respect to white racial preservation.”
There was a nearly genocidal proposal offered on the other thread by Trainspotter, whereby Nordics would be offered Pro-Natality subsidies from the tax payers that would be denied to a certain number of Mediterranean tax payers, and oddly enough nobody saw fit to object to it except a single poster who is against Nordicism.
And the thing is that even if such a program started out only putting Mediterraneans with a small amount of genes that appear Non-European at a comparative reproductive disadvantage, there’s no reason it wouldn’t go further than that, and no reason the genetic test couldn’t be gamed to give Mediterraneans far more false positives of Non-White ancestry.
For example, if you assigned slight Non-European Caucasian admixture an equal weight as slight American Indian and slight Proto-Mongoloid admixture, in spite of Non-European Caucasians being much closer to Whites, this would impose an arbitrary and Proto-Genocidal reproductive burden on Meds.
Robert Campbell,
“A lot of people in the British Isles have Mediterranean blood somewhere, sure, but certainly not all of them, and it’s a rather moot argument anyway, as these types are assimilated to the point of being peripheral Nordish and assailable into the Nordish racial core.”
That’s part of the problem with Nordics, they have a history of engorging themselves on other subraces without there being reciprocity.
Besides the important issue of this reducing diversity needlessly, this also has the effect of victimizing the other races on a genetic level.
If two races are to be turned into one, it must be done in such a way as to respect the genetic interests of both races.
That is NOT what the Anglo-Saxons did to the Britons. That is NOT what some Vikings did to certain parts of Russia. That is NOT what some other Vikings did to an extreme northern part of France.
And truth be told this was not what the National Socialists would’ve done to the Russians, had they won that conflict.
That’s part of the problem with Nordics, they have a history of engorging themselves on other subraces without there being reciprocity.
No. Our problem is inviting in aliens and allowing them to take over our societies.
“Engorging” ourselves? What are you talking about?
Reciprocity? It really is about Nordic females, isn’t it?
Besides the important issue of this reducing diversity needlessly, this also has the effect of victimizing the other races on a genetic level.
Wow. Now you’re just blatantly using the Left’s anti-White arguments against us. So now “diversity is strength” and we’re “victimizing the other races”?
If two races are to be turned into one, it must be done in such a way as to respect the genetic interests of both races.
Who said anything about mixing? That is completely antithetical to our goal of Nordish preservation.
“Reciprocity? It really is about Nordic females, isn’t it?”
In any scheme where the Men of Tribe A are allowed access to ANY of the Women of Tribe B, the only way to prevent the genes of Tribe B being replaced is for the Men of Tribe B to be allowed access to the Women of Tribe A.
This is reciprocity.
While this has the serious downside of diluting both races, at least their respective gene level inclusive fitness will be respected.
You won’t have the genes of one Tribe replacing the genes of the other.
Robert Campbell described as some kind of good thing cases in History where Nordics used the technique of unreciprocated subrace mixing to wipe out massive numbers of Non-Nordic White genes.
This is very disturbing to me.
“Wow. Now you’re just blatantly using the Left’s anti-White arguments against us. So now ‘diversity is strength’ and we’re ‘victimizing the other races‘?”
Taking the view that the destruction of Intra-White Genetic Diversity is a bad thing hardly amounts to an inherently Leftist argument.
It is merely an Anti-Genocidalist argument.
“…and we’re ‘victimizing the other races‘?”
I was speaking of certain undeniable events that occurred in the past, and which constitute a pattern of Nordic evolutionary strategy. Thankfully you aren’t currently victimizing other subraces of Whites.
“Who said anything about mixing? That is completely antithetical to our goal of Nordish preservation.”
You’ve defined the term Nordish so loosely that it certainly will lead to mixing, and in the context of a Nordic dominated Nordish Ethnostate, this will almost certainly lead to the large scale replacement of Non-Nordic Genes by Nordic Genes.
Robert Campbell described as some kind of good thing cases in History where Nordics used the technique of unreciprocated subrace mixing to wipe out massive numbers of Non-Nordic White genes.
Well, “good” obviously depends on perspective and identity here.
Taking the view that the destruction of Intra-White Genetic Diversity is a bad thing hardly amounts to an inherently Leftist argument.
It is merely an Anti-Genocidalist argument.
None of the Nordish preservationists here is advocating the genocide of non-Nordish Whites and the destruction of intra-White genetic diversity. Nordish preservation is the preservation of intra-White genetic diversity. Those who are against Nordish preservation and seek to impede it are the ones who aim to destroy intra-White genetic diversity and are genocidalist. None of us is clamoring for access to Med females.
Thankfully you aren’t currently victimizing other subraces of Whites.
We’re currently being victimized by other subraces of Whites.
You’ve defined the term Nordish so loosely that it certainly will lead to mixing, and in the context of a Nordic dominated Nordish Ethnostate, this will almost certainly lead to the large scale replacement of Non-Nordic Genes by Nordic Genes.
It can be clarified and refined. At any rate, within a Nordish ethnostate, I don’t see why the replacement would be a problem. That would be part of the point.
Again: http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2008/09/geography-and-genetic-structure-in.html
The Western British have no close or special relationship to Iberians, much less other “Meds”.
Madison Grant is 100% Northwestern European. Nor does he look remotely “Med”; but if he did it would be irrelevant. British “Atlanto-Meds” are no more closely related to Italians or Greeks than are British Nordics.
The French cluster genetically with other West/Central Europeans. PCA and MDS plots show minimal overlap between the French and the Spanish or Italians. As one would expect based on geography, some French will be more similar to Northern Italians or Spaniards. But on the whole, the French tend to be more similar to Germans and Brits.
Racially, Northwestern Europeans form a coherent group. “Meds” do not.
Visualize concentric circles radiating out from Great Britain on plots like the one linked above (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ro2ijOk8JWc/SLs7sALkwoI/AAAAAAAAATs/sa2Ig1gv31M/s1600-h/novembre.jpg), and it should be clear that it’s perfectly reasonable for Northwestern Europeans concerned with racial preservation to define their ingroup in ways which, for example, include the French and exclude Southern Italians.
Draw concentric circles around Greece, and you’ll include much of the Middle East before you ever get to France.
Reginald’s assertion that Northern European preservationists want to “grab French women for themselves” is bizarre and tends to support blake’s assessment of his motives. It would of course make no sense from the standpoint of racial preservation to include French women but exclude French men in a proposed state. We can infer that Reginald is not French but believes he has a right to French women (or half-French, half-Irish women, as the case may be).