Bob Dylan has given an interview to Rolling Stone magazine in which he is widely quoted saying that the “stigma of slavery ruined America” because America was “founded on the backs of slaves.”
He also added that “people (are) at each other’s throats just because they are of a different color” and added that “it will hold any nation back.” He also says blacks know that some whites “didn’t want to give up slavery.”
In his view, “if slavery had been given up in a more peaceful way, America would be far ahead today.”
Where to start?
(1) First, the Northern colonies (and later the Northern states) were the first colonies in the Western hemisphere to abolish slavery. In 1777, Vermont adopted a constitution that abolished slavery. Connecticut finally abolished slavery in 1848.
(2) Second, African slavery had been legal for centuries. By the time Europeans started importing slaves en masse into the Western hemisphere, millions of African slaves had already been sold to Muslims in the Islamic world.
These blacks were sold into slavery almost exclusively by other blacks in exchange for guns, liquor, clothing, sea shells, and other European manufactured goods. Unlike Europeans, the Africans themselves saw nothing wrong with slavery, which was customary in Africa. In fact, West African states protested the abolition of the slave trade and continued to bring slaves to their coast (where they were illegally sold and smuggled to Brazil and Cuba) long after the slave trade was abolished.
It was Europeans who came up with the idea that African slavery was immoral. It was also Europeans who used military force to abolish the slave trade and who later abolished slavery in their African colonies. Were it not for European imperialism, slavery would be widespread in Africa today, and it still exists in some places like South Sudan and Mauritania.
(3) Third, few Americans realize how widespread slavery was until the nineteenth century. The Greeks and Romans had practiced slavery. The Vikings had practiced slavery. The Turks, Chinese, Aztecs, Inca and most other civilizations practiced slavery. Slavery wasn’t abolished in Western Europe until well into the Middle Ages. It continued to exist in Russia and Eastern Europe for long thereafter. The word “slave” originally meant “slav.”
Over a million Europeans were enslaved by the Barbary corsairs in North Africa. There is nothing unique about African slavery. The Bible is full of stories about slavery. The Greeks and Romans had practiced slavery. St. Paul, St. Augustine, and the Catholic Church sanctioned and justified slavery. The Justinian Code sanctioned slavery.
The idea that slavery is immoral was a radical idea until the early nineteenth century when Europeans began to stigmatize and abolish slavery in their colonies. Now, of course, Europeans are arraigned and condemned by non-Whites on the basis of their own “human rights” ideology, an ideology which wasn’t shared by the Africans at the time who were profiting from the transatlantic slave trade.
If the “stigma of slavery” ruined America, it also ruined … well, pretty much the entire world, which practiced slavery at some point or another.
(4) Racial conflict exists independently of slavery. In the United States, blacks and Hispanics are at each others throats in cities like Los Angeles, Philadelphia, and Chicago, even though Hispanics had nothing to do with African slavery.
In places like Guyana and Trinidad and Tobago, where enormous numbers of Asian indentured workers were imported to work on sugar plantations after the British abolition of slavery, the American black vs. White dynamic is replaced by black vs. Asian racial division.
(5) The first state in the Western hemisphere to abolish slavery was Saint-Domingue in 1794 and later Haiti in 1804 – which is now by far the poorest country in the Western hemisphere, unlike Guadeloupe, where slavery was restored in 1803 and wasn’t abolished until 1848, or Martinique, where slavery was never abolished in 1794, but continued until 1848.
The United States was one of the last countries in the Western hemisphere to abolish slavery. It was abolished in Haiti in 1804, Mexico in 1820, Chile in 1823, Central America in 1824, Jamaica, Guyana, Trinidad and Tobago, and Barbados in 1838, the Danish Virgin Islands in 1848, and Guadeloupe, French Guiana, and Martinique in 1848.
In most cases (Haiti and the U.S. are the major exceptions), slavery was peacefully abolished, but it hardly follows that Mexico or Jamaica is better off than the United States as a consequence. In the 21st century, black people in the United States live better than black people do anywhere in Africa, or most of the rest of the world for that matter.*
They owe it to slavery. They should be thankful for slavery … which brought them to religion and civilization.
* The only real exceptions are black people who are fortunate enough to live in other European countries like the U.K., France, or Canada or in former slave colonies like Bermuda, Guadeloupe, or Aruba which are still tied to their metropoles. Literally everywhere else in the world free black people have demonstrated that they lack the capacity to a maintain a European level of civilization.
“if slavery had been given up in a more peaceful way, America would be far ahead today.”
He’s absolutely right. The entire rest of Christendom was able to abolish slavery without a suicidal war between Whites. The genocidal slaughter of over 600,00 Whites here in America is the proof of his statement.
Didn’t Bob Dylan run out on his first wife for some niggress?
I was having a conversation with a friend the other day. They were under the impression blacks had always been in the west indies. I had to explain how mainly the Spanish/French plantation complex imported Africans to work the islands after the natives perished from disease/work. They had no idea.
“If the “stigma of slavery” ruined America, it also ruined … well, pretty much the entire world, which practiced slavery at some point or another.” HW
It doesn’t work that way. The left only holds the usa up to those standards, the yankees (american leftist) only hold the South to those standards. Everyone else gets a free pass. This logic applies to all their “moral” arguments
Bob Zimmerman looks a bit demonic on that cover. Photoshop in a pitchfork and voilà. Beezlebob.
He’s badly misinformed or just a liar. America is the destination of choice for black migrants. Shiet the USA is run for niggers these days. An entire political party has been taken over by them.
@Rudel
Common ignorance about the War of Northern Aggression. The driving issue was not slavery, hence Lincoln not emancipating until a couple years in when the north was struggling (and even if you want to work slavery into the pretext for war it dealt with new states in the west and what their position would be, still state’s rights and economy trumped that worry). Even then the declaration only freed slaves in certain regions. Of course people are so dumbed down today they think the “Civil War” was only fought to free the slaves and that Lincoln was the second-coming.
If it had been gradually phased out as it was in British colonies or indeed those of the Dutch (1880s) some parts of the south might not be blighted with 100 + years of human termite damage. It might resemble, in some cases, the genteel examples of the
caribbean islands that are still dependencies. But we will never know because negrophiles butchered white men to set wild animals free. Plus ca change Bob.
Rudel,
In that sense, yes.
Slavery should have been left alone. Eventually, mechanization in the twentieth century would have abolished the need for slavery in the sugar colonies and cotton states.
Then the blacks could have been safely disposed of in Europe’s African colonies.
“He also added that “people (are) at each other’s throats just because they are of a different color” and added that “it will hold any nation back.” He also says blacks know that some whites “didn’t want to give up slavery.”” – Naturally the north should be relatively crime free, and have peace and harmony.
It is the basic disparity between blacks and whites that is the issue, not history which they didn’t bother to learn. And that issue won’t be solved short of separation of violence.
Alabama didn’t even become a state until 1819. Slavery was abolished in 1865. We’re talking about two generations of slavery which supposedly crippled the blacks here for eternity.
Slavery lasted far longer in New York than Texas.
Maxx,
Lincoln was almost certainly a deranged negrophile. All his banter about blacks being inferior was a fascade. He militantly despised his white brethren in the south. Give it a few hundred years and he’s an embarrasing footnote in history.
I had to explain how mainly the Spanish/French plantation complex imported Africans to work the islands after the natives perished from disease/work. They had no idea.
The majority of Whites in the US have no clue. The jew media is a very effective tool. The selective history shown and taught is very telling.
Jew, Bob Zimmerman, was a big influence in the cultural revolution that took place during the 60’s.
Zimmerman has frizzy hair and has very Asiatic features. Yet, a German surname.
A testament of Jewish infiltration in the White race/culture.
Jews are not White in anyway.
He resembles a rat and that’s what he is.
Well, Sweden was not founded on slavery and problems are exactly the same. Or even worse. There is a website http://www.nationell.nu/ for some hardcore multiculti interested persons. It,s in swedish, but google translate works well.
“..In the small village of Glava in Arvika lives today 200 Swedes. But soon, the population increased by 50 percent when the Migration Board to place the 100 refugees at the luxurious castle Glava guest farm…..”
http://www.nationell.nu/2012/09/10/by-med-200-svenskar-ska-ta-emot-100-flyktingar-som-far-lyxslott/
“”…Village with 800 Swedes are forced to accept 400 refugees. Soon a large asylum accommodation located in the small village Hållsta in Eskilstunda. Migration Board’s intention is to place the refugees in the gigantic old IBM building…””
http://www.nationell.nu/2012/09/11/by-med-800-svenskar-tvingas-ta-emot-400-flyktingar/
“”….As an increasing number of refugees seeking asylum in Sweden will increase the need for housing. Homes that do not exist. That is why politicians in Eskilstuna come up with a new solution. Swedes must take care of the refugees in their own homes…..””
http://www.nationell.nu/2012/09/13/politikernas-nya-losning-svenskarna-ska-ta-hand-om-flyktingarna-i-sina-hem/
And lot of coverage, how integration goes without legacy of slavery and colonialism. Something holds nonwhites back in Sweden too.
Zimmerman, Seinfeld, Speilberg, Weinstein brothers, Wolfowitz, Chertoff, Kagan, ect. Should be the first to be looking down at a pre-dug ditch with the sound of rifles being cocked and redied for executions just feet behind them.
“Slavery should have been left alone. Eventually, mechanization in the twentieth century would have abolished the need for slavery in the sugar colonies and cotton states.
Then the blacks could have been safely disposed of in Europe’s African colonies.”
Or Brazil. In any case yes, my point is that the entire war was a tragedy of monumental proportions. And I certainly lay most of the blame at the foot of the Republican Party, both the high tariff industrial wing and the batshit crazy Radical Republican abolitionists. The South is not entirely blameless however and should have seen the writing on the wall in the rest of the world and been less fukcing intransigent about extending slavery to the territories.
White self-genocide of the bravest young men among us is dysgenic and it happened yet again fifty years later.
“Zimmerman has frizzy hair and has very Asiatic features. Yet, a German surname. A testament of Jewish infiltration in the White race/culture.”
Nevertheless he was a troubadour and poet of the first rank from a family of miners from the Iron Range of Minnesota:
Grandpa died last week
And now he’s buried in the rocks
But everybody still talks about
How badly they were shocked
But me, I expected it to happen
I knew he’d lost control
When he built a fire on Main Street
And shot it full of holes
Oh, Mama, can this really be the end
To be stuck inside of Mobile
With the Memphis blues again
Well, the last I heard of Arab
He was stuck on a whale
That was married to the deputy
Sheriff of the jail
But the funniest thing was
When I was leavin’ the bay
I saw three ships a-sailin’
They were all heading my way
I asked the captain what his name was
And how come he didn’t drive a truck
He said his name was Columbus
I just said, “Good luck”
This could easily be the theme song of this website.
You must leave now, take what you need, you think will last
But whatever you wish to keep, you better grab it fast
Yonder stands your orphan with his gun
Crying like a fire in the sun
Look out the saints are comin’ through
And it’s all over now, Baby Blue
The highway is for gamblers, better use your sense
Take what you have gathered from coincidence
The empty-handed painter from your streets
Is drawing crazy patterns on your sheets
This sky, too, is folding under you
And it’s all over now, Baby Blue
All your seasick sailors, they are rowing home
All your reindeer armies, are all going home
The lover who just walked out your door
Has taken all his blankets from the floor
The carpet, too, is moving under you
And it’s all over now, Baby Blue
Leave your stepping stones behind, something calls for you
Forget the dead you’ve left, they will not follow you
The vagabond who’s rapping at your door
Is standing in the clothes that you once wore
Strike another match, go start anew
And it’s all over now, Baby Blue
Or perhaps this:
“There must be some way out of here,” said the joker to the thief
“There’s too much confusion, I can’t get no relief
Businessmen, they drink my wine, plowmen dig my earth
None of them along the line know what any of it is worth”
“No reason to get excited,” the thief, he kindly spoke
“There are many here among us who feel that life is but a joke
But you and I, we’ve been through that, and this is not our fate
So let us not talk falsely now, the hour is getting late”
All along the watchtower, princes kept the view
While all the women came and went, barefoot servants, too
Outside in the distance a wildcat did growl
Two riders were approaching, the wind began to howl
Dylan is right, though he may not know it. The stigma of slavery ruined America. Not slavery; the stigma. The constant bewailing and self-flagellation. Get over it, already.
Slavery, as others have noted, was ubiquitous. Africans attained their highest value and level of civilization as slaves. Slavery wasn’t the evil; the evil was the failure to prevent the proliferation of Africans in the slave-holding societies. Arabs didn’t make this mistake; they castrated their slaves. America should have, too.
The Jews are going to keep poking the Tiger until it KILLS them!
Keep poking Jew! Keep it up! You’re chosen all right!
Where do you begin?
Where else?
“Bob Dylan was born “Robert Allen Zimmerman” (Hebrew name ????? ????? ?? ????? [Shabtai Zisel ben Avraham])[15][16] in St. Mary’s Hospital on May 24, 1941, in Duluth, Minnesota,[17][18] and raised in Hibbing, Minnesota, on the Mesabi Iron Range west of Lake Superior. His paternal grandparents, Zigman and Anna Zimmerman, emigrated from Odessa in the Russian Empire (now Ukraine) to the United States following the anti-Semitic pogroms of 1905.[19] His maternal grandparents, Benjamin and Lybba Edelstein, were Lithuanian Jews who arrived in the United States in 1902.[19] In his autobiography Chronicles: Volume One, Dylan writes that his paternal grandmother’s maiden name was Kirghiz and her family originated from Ka??zman in Turkey.” https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Dylan
A no-talent JEW, whose opinions in a real nation- a Christian Dixie, for example, would mean NOTHING, because, as a hominid, JEWS MEAN NOTHING.
Without reading his entire interview, which I am not inclined to do, it is difficult to know his context. One can guess, and probably be right. At the same time, why people look to “stars” for moral or intellectual guidance is beyond me. Especially when they discuss politics or sociology, subjects that, for them, are usually expressed out of mere emotion mixed in with our received liberal culture.
Most of it is media made fraud. On his early record the liner notes report how during his week at college, [Dylan] remembers staying up all night plowing through the philosophy of Kant instead of reading “Living With the Birds” for a science course.
Imagine that. A one night stand with Kant. The artist, a man with not a little insight into the human emotion known as scorn, must have felt some embarrassment at that one. Or maybe he simply laughed at the gullible who believed, and those who had no idea about it but bought his records anyway.
Zimmerman like most jews has changed his name hoping that will keep his secret. Zimmerman is the typical rat faced jew. He failed to mention that jews ran the slave trade in this country. Zews made millions on the blacks of blacks. The biggest slave traders were blacks and Arabs. Zimmerman is a puke. I have never been able to understand a word that jew has said. How anyone can call that crap he mumbles out is beyond me.
Strange, I’m under the impression that the United States had the most thriving and productive economy and highest standards of living prior to the ‘Civil Rights’ revolution and the emergence of BRA and that the decline began soon after. If slavery ruined the United States then logically it would have come prior to the 1970’s. Dylan despite his talents is no more than a baby boomer fool.
How anyone can call that crap he mumbles out music is beyond me.
Good catch AnalogMan. The STIGMA is the problem. Dylan’s inadvertent confession/Freudian slip.
America is being ruined by the overrreach of civil right legislation.
HW says:
“….Third, few Americans realize how widespread slavery was until the nineteenth century. The Greeks and Romans had practiced slavery. The Vikings had practiced slavery. The Turks, Chinese, Aztecs, Inca….”
Yes, the problem is not slavery, per se, BUT THE USE OF THE IDEA OF IT in order to destroy certain White populations in the u.s.
This is why, increasingly, I see it as a North American problem, largely driven by catholics (who have a deep trouble in processing their own flaws and “evil.”) They see slavery as ‘bad” and so they don’t want to account for Spain and Portugal, etc, the main drivers of slavery in North America.
So, they dump the “slavery issue” on the upper South (the protestants only who owned slaves). They made them the scapegoat of all slavery in the world, and especially of slavery in the “americas.”
This has to do with their problems in processing their own ownership of slaves. (And how the Jesuits began to conceptualize catholic “slavery” in the south americas, ideas of which have now been imported into the u.s.)
If you look at it that way, it all makes much better sense. Both catholics and jews have gained phenomenally (financially and in the sense of their own “morality” and in other ways, by holding political positions while turning u.s. into a “tax state,” etc.) by placing world slavery on southern protestants.
It really is just about money.
But because they’ve been so successful via msm, especially film, in “moralizing” the slave issue, and in obscuring their own parts in slavery (and blaming largely only one white group, and the one least involved, really)—- it may help to use talking points that account for that moralizing of it (even though it’s sort of untrue and stupid).
It’s helpful to talk about the reality of world slavery. OTOH, most in “the masses” are just moralists (and always will be.)
So—- “Slavery is one thing. But the vilification programs and eradication of a slave owning society, its people and its history is Genocide.
Genocide is worse than slavery.
This is why the Union was so pernicious.
It dramatized and heriocized the anti-slavery movement.
Without that war we would have seen slavery as a social history footnote. A blip on the
economic history of the area. The entire history of the Caribbean would be seen in a very different light too.
HW said,
“….If the “stigma of slavery” ruined America, it also ruined … well, pretty much the entire world, which practiced slavery at some point or another…..”
The key word here is not ‘slavery,” but STIGMA.
It’s about who “stimgatized” slavery, when and where, and for what benefits. As you note, it was NOT stigmatized anywhere else. So why is it stigmatized (and by whom) in the u.s. south the MOST, and in S. Africa (the other place where it’s heavily stigmatized on the same level??)
Who has most benefited by stigmatizing the upper southerns and the S. Africans?
Dylan (a jew, yes) is sharp here—- he says STIGMA ruined the country, not slavery.
He says (without saying) that “Change” as being spoken of politically now, is not what’s wanted. It’s implied those people should have THEIR HEARTS “changed.” And God changes the heart.
Address “Stigma”— and then the opposition (those involved in this Defamation) are then put on the defensive.
Using the idea of past slavery to justify Genociding a culture (the white south) is the issue. Genocide is worse than slavery.
@ John
“Without that war we would have seen slavery as a social history footnote…”
Idk— the war is less the issue than the 24-7 production of Defamation movies. The war, too, could have just ended, (and with NO CONTINUING ongoing cultural production of laws, radio, t.v., film, etc.— the whole point of which is to USE
“slavery” (mostly as produced in movies) as the rationale for eradicating white southerners.
The war ended 150 years ago! But the movies produced to justify the pacification of white southern people ARE RIGHT NOW.
Slavery ended. The war ended.
But SOMEBODY uses “slavery” right NOW (by making movies and reports right now about it, everyday)—- to justify taking southern property, to pacify white southern people who never owned slaves, to wipe out their heritage and culture, and what they have to say about themselves (stripping them of any real and authentic voice), etc.
Why does Tarantino make Django Unchained—- 150 years LATER? That’s the current question.
No one makes films about the apprentise phase of Jamaican history. It’s not dramatic enough. War creates the herioc body, in the form of martyr, victim, casualties, warhero, grizzled veteran, into which subsequent agenda can be poured.
Again, no one makes films about concilliations and resolution of conflict.
One thing that has always struck me about American films on the WAr of Independence is that those films flop. Most people in America couldn’t care less it seems.
Contemporary conflict and speculative fiction are much better money makers.
Rudel,
OT. But given your comments on No Country for Old Men, you may also believe in the ‘cult of the individual artist,’ and actually think Dylan writes all his own lyrics, since you’re spewing them (he might do so more than most). I f nothing else, the similarities in Madonna, Gaga, Beyonce, Rhianna, Britney, etc., might point people toward the level at which “cultural” production is being done by committee and has been for some time.
You might like Dave McGowan’s Laurel Canyon research, if you haven’t read it.
John says,
One thing that has always struck me about American films on the WAr of Independence is that those films flop. Most people in America couldn’t care less it seems….
True. The “slavery meme” is such an underpinning of the current “society,” and everybody MAKES MONEY on it. Keep it stoked—- and you have the justification for genocide of whites, or at least The Tobacco Acts: Did more non-southern protestant Whites, or more Slaves, benefit from that land redistribution act?)
So, the Tarantinos don’t get academy awards for nothing. Dylan has played for the pope. Elton John, Mick Jagger, and Bono are knighted by the queen, as well as many others.
In the old days in Greece, those sirens used to sing and crash ships on the rocks, keeping foreigners off the island. Today’s sirens ensure they come onto the land. Go figure.
The stigma of slavery ruined America.
I’d have to disagree with that statement.
It’s actually jew Hollywood’s relentless guilt-trip preaching.
The constant bewailing and self-flagellation.
I’ve been reading this theme here and elsewhere. I think its a white trait to want to do better, go further and faster, and continuous improvement and these all lead to technological and social advancement which made Europe what is and Europeans successful wherever they go.
However, if you start guilt tripping with Holohoax and slavery lies then Europeans start thinking “we must to better” (i.e. guilt tripping). So, its not “self-flagellation” per se but the “drive to do better”. The Jews in Hollywood understand this trait of ours and therefore tailor movies to play on it. Why do you think we get a steady diet of Hitler and southern slavery movies and TV shows, etc.. Not all of us are of German decent but we’re all white and related (if you go back far enough) so we all “share” the responsibility of Hitler “evil myths”.
I disagree about the Hitler thing. However the ww2 stories are getting boring. Some producer or other is going to get what’s coming to him. If that Bacile Fellow goes down it’s open season. See how legal mechanisms are being used to get him? What’s good for him is good for any other filmaker.
However the ww2 stories are getting boring.
To you may be, but not to the younger generation.
I had this little Sheeny Bastid’s number in 1968. There was a double album of bootlegged Dylan music that got played a lot on WAAM in Ann Arbor. One of the songs that they played way too often was a happy little ditty about a nigger in the South who got lynched because he liked to read.
One of the lines in the song was a nasal impersonation of an inbred that said, “I guess ol’ Jackson’s alright, but what’s a goddamn nigger need with all of them books.”
I suppose Bob learned everything he new about niggers, slavery and racial prejudice during his formative years up on the Iron Range in Hibbing, MN. Prior to the 1980’s, I don’t think that even one single nigger had ever walked down any of the streets in Hibbing. Mr. Zimmerman was long gone and busy chugging rod in the East Village before that happened.
I’m under 40. Something of a ww2 buff myself. I don’t think kids relate to ww2 anymore. Blackhawk down is ancient history to these folks.
I’m under 40. Something of a ww2 buff myself. I don’t think kids relate to ww2 anymore. Blackhawk down is ancient history to these folks.
Young people, including girls, in their 20’s still suck this stuff up. The Hitler Channel is still going strong. As an example, the girl who cuts my hair told me that she and her female friend love Hitler stuff – and I never initiated the conversation.
If you noticed in today’s OD post “Selma Blacks Outraged Over Replacement Forrest Bust”, the black dude in the video uses the Nazi (myth) as a white guilt trip argument.
Typical Jew. And they wonder why they are hated.
The smartest blacks understand Jews used them and continue to do so.
Never liked Bob Dylan. Always thought he and his music sucked. I think he needs to take his whine to Israel and wank about those poor needy blacks they put in camps before deporting.
Wait, she liked the cut of the jib of the Nazis Supremacism or
she liked contemplating the evil of the Nazis?
That’s an ambiguity.
Never liked Bob Dylan. Always thought he and his music sucked.
Me too.
I know a lot of musicians/arty types and some have actually gasped in horror when I have expressed such thoughts, lol. Dylan/Zimmerman has always reminded me of an annoying mosquito.
I thought his son’s music wasn’t bad.
Mary says:
‘Never liked Bob Dylan. Always thought he and his music sucked.’
Worst voice ever!