Response to Harold Covington

Harold Covington sees "competitors" everywhere.

Washington

Yesterday morning, Pastor Lindstedt informed me that Harold Covington had mentioned Occidental Dissent in the latest broadcast of Radio Free Northwest. I listened to the podcast and mulled over writing a response. Last night, I received a phone call from a friend about the issue, as Covington also slandered The Occidental Quarterly in his diatribe.

(1) Nothing in my writing indicates that I am “raging” about the Northwest. I’ve spent the last few weeks analyzing the impact of the 2010 midterm elections at the state level. I have written about Utah, Mississippi, Texas, Iowa, Wisconsin, Tennessee, Virginia, Georgia, Massachusetts and Rhode Island.

(2) This website is self financed out of my own pocket. Unlike Harold Covington, I have a job which pays the bills. I don’t work for The Occidental Quarterly or solicit donations here anymore.

(3) I don’t consider Harold Covington and The Northwest Front a “threat” or a “competitor” to Occidental Dissent. Jack Ryan has been advertising Radio Free Northwest here for months. We have been sending traffic his way.

(4) I think Covington is living in a fantasy world. It is hard enough to get White Nationalists to eat breakfast with you at an IHOP restaurant. The notion that these people are going to form a vanguard and launch an IRA style insurrection against the U.S. federal government and win … well, let’s just say that a flying saucer is more likely to land on the White House lawn before something like that happens.

Yesterday, Covington spent a considerable amount of time discussing whether or not a stock exchange would exist in the Northwest Republic. I think HAC might be getting a little ahead of himself here. I don’t even think there is a restaurant or a gas station affiliated with the Northwest Front.

(5) Years ago, HAC had a video on YouTube of men in camo with rocket launchers and machine guns going wild. For some reason, I thought those were his supporters at the time. I can’t seem to find the video now.

(6) In the podcast, Covington disavowed the need to do anything practical. Instead, he reiterated his plea for White Nationalists in other parts of America to uproot themselves and move to the Pacific Northwest.

There are over 10 million Americans now living in the Northwest. 6.6. million of them live in Washington state. The vast majority of them are White. Why can’t Harold Covington recruit from this vast constituency and prove to skeptics that his plan is viable and has the support of the indigenous population?

(7) A successful insurgency is inconceivable in the absence of local support. If Covington was serious about this idea, he would focus his efforts on establishing a power base among the natives already on the ground in the region.

(8) There are 3.5 million people in the Seattle metropolitan area. The vast majority of them are liberals. In 2008, King County went 69.97 percent for Barack Obama. His margin of victory there and in neighboring counties in Western Washington ensured that Obama carried the state in a landslide.

There are about 550,000 people in Wyoming. Unlike Washington, which is politically dominated by the SWPL vote, Wyoming is the most conservative state in America. The locals are highly supportive of gun rights and have strong grievances against the federal government over public land ownership.

If there was a “Northwest Migration,” it would make a lot more sense to relocate to Wyoming or Alaska where the smaller population would allow migrant White Nationalists to have a far greater impact.

About Hunter Wallace 11873 Articles
Founder and Editor-in-Chief of Occidental Dissent

50 Comments

  1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyoming_House_of_Representatives

    The Wyoming House of Representatives is the lower house of the Wyoming State Legislature. There are 60 Representatives in the House, representing an equal amount of single-member constituent districts across the state, each with a population of at least 9,000. The House convenes at the Wyoming State Capitol in Cheyenne.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyoming_Senate

    The Wyoming Senate is the upper house of the Wyoming State Legislature. There are 30 Senators in the Senate, representing an equal amount of constituencies across Wyoming, each with a population of at least 17,000. The Senate meets at the Wyoming State Capitol in Cheyenne.

  2. HW,

    I apologize for my part in mentioning his name given the context in which his name came up. Just to clarify, the only reason I asked CC about it was because I was impressed by Gregor’s comments and thought it plausible there might be a serious and well accomplished person behind that pseudonym, someone very advanced in his learning. That was my only interest in the issue, curiosity about who an insightful commenter might be, not any other aspect. But it was a mistake to mention it given the context, and for that I apologize to you and all other parties.

  3. HW: Wyoming has a much smaller, far more conservative population. Suppose for a moment that 30,000 White Nationalists moved to Wyoming and got involved in mainstream politics. The impact upon the political spectrum would be felt immediately. This is especially true of the Wyoming state legislature.”

    David Frum explains how it’s possible for small committed groups to influence elections.This technique would never work for WN up to the national level like with Sharron Angle. It might be feasible at the local and state level though.

    The secret of success in business is leverage: Use $2 of your own to gain 51% control of a $4 asset, then use the $4 asset to gain 51% of an $8 asset, and soon you have built yourself a vast global conglomerate using a huge vast amount of other people’s money.

    Politics is based upon the same secret. If you can organize a few dozen like-minded friends, you can seize control of a county organization. Add a few more counties, and soon you are running a state party organization. Next thing you know: you are running a grand national party.

    The secret of the success of candidates like Christine O’Donnell and Sharron Angle is that participation in primary elections is usually low – and participation in the organizing activities preceding the primary is even lower. There’s the opportunity for political leverage

    http://www.frumforum.com/how-to-hijack-a-political-party

  4. I would like to have a Washington vs. Wyoming debate on the Northwest Migration. I think this would be an excellent topic to debate.

    HAC pushes the accident of his own location. Not the most reasonable. There is no influencing the Northwest. As someone said up there, Enemy Occupied Territory. They are inimical to the core. As to Newberg: why isolate an oxgang of land within such enemy territory when Wyoming is free range? One may doubt, however, the existence of “30,000 White Nationalists” of any stripe, let alone those willing to move to the American tundra.

    Tell you what though, I would do it, and have considered WY before. Cheap land out there, boys. You too can own 40 acres of BLM scrub for under $40,000! Can you hear the wind through Rawhide Buttes calling you?

    LOL.

  5. Bob Whitaker has two recent posts dealing with the “Macho cynicism” that afflicts us, just a suggested read.

  6. We can handle the cold, and it has the advantage of keeping out the warm-climate-adapted riffraff,

    There is truth to this. I’m torn between living it up with the riffraff down in the Caribbean or honoring my European Dasein by freezing my ass off up here. Basic contradiction of my nature.

    WE can be self-sufficient while everyone else grovels, begging us to share.

    Surely you mean “forces us to share at gunpoint”, for there’s the terminus of that route. You’ve heard of this tragic Holodomor business?

  7. Isn’t it totally, anachronistically masochistic to elect to live in a state that looks like this?

    http://www.naturespicsonline.com/misc/SitesPhotos/wyoming.jpg

    Let’s remember that WNs are a cross-section of white subraces. Only a small fraction of those will be of the race adapted to farming on the tundra. If one is already in Wyoming engaged in such pursuits, one is likely of that race, thus supposed to be there. I know I’m more adapted to sleazy hot weather and cheap beer than cultivating hard red wheat and driving a Dodge Ram. What about you guys? Captain? How’s your Angus doing?

  8. Covington wants Washington state as part of his country because he doesn’t want the White Republic to be landlocked. That’s a fine idea, but the facts on the ground preclude it. Covington’s unwillingness to face facts is just part of his generally sketchy character.

    Idaho and Wyoming are more credible potential White Republics, but that won’t happen unless the federal government collapses. In that scenario being landlocked isn’t as much of a problem since the global blockade by the jews would have no leadership and neighboring states would probably allow commerce to continue.

  9. Alaska isn’t landlocked. It also has the benefit of having a far smaller, more conservative population and not being geographically contiguous with the continental United States.

    Alaska has the same grievances against the federal government over federal land ownership as the other Western states. It has vast natural resources which are locked up by environmentalist groups.

    It is also a huge state. Then you have to factor in global warming. Suppose Al Gore is right. Alaska might become a more attractive destination for WN settlers.

  10. Hunter,

    Covington is certainly aware of the preponderance of liberals in particular parts of the Northwest. This is why in his novels he writes of the need to clear them out once (hypothetically speaking) victory is won and focuses on the rural and working-class population as fleshing out the ranks of his “political soldiers”. Moreover, Covington recognizes that for a White ethnostate to be viable, assuming the United States with its government in D.C. is still extant and thus capable of threatening the new ethnostate, that ethnostate must have an ocean coastline that can facilitate trade and be defended against blockade. If the ethnostate is landlocked, such as in the case of Wyoming and Montana, clearly encircling it would be less difficult a task. Alaska is not landlocked, but its climate is too harsh to accomodate a sufficient crop yield to feed the White populace so that they don’t starve.

  11. Uh,

    I live in Michigan, where the winters are colder than Wyoming’s. Here it is more felicitous to hunt deer than raise cattle.

  12. There are other problems with Alaska besides farming conditions. According to John Rawles, Alaska is almost totally dependent on the continental US for resupply. If true, the Fed Gov could cut that off easy.

    Rawles writes about collapse scenarios full time and says this about Alaska’s viability from a collapse perspective. In Rawles’ vernacular, a “retreat destination” is a place that you would want to vacate to to survive a collapse. Even if there is no total systemic collapse as Rawles imagines, the Fed Gov could still strangle Alaska’s White population by exploiting geography.

    Why not Alaska?

    A year ago, I heard one “expert” on the radio recommend Alaska as a retreat destination because it has the lowest population density of any State, and has low taxes. IMHO, he couldn’t be more wrong!

    The biggest problem is that from an economic standpoint, Alaska is essentially a big offshore island. Many essential items are shipped or flown in. What happens when the ships and planes stop arriving? It won’t be pretty–at least not in Alaska’s cities.

  13. Where there are few non-whites, such as the Northwest, white consciousness is low. But if white consciousness were to rise at such a location, it would be the ideal location for an ethnostate since it would not require huge population transfers to bring about an amicable divorce between the races.

    Where there are many non-whites, as in the South, white consciousness is high. But a white ethnostate is unlikely to emerge there because of the sheer magnitude of the non-white population, which, realistically, the white man will not be able to screw up the gumption to cast out.

    Covington has an elegant solution to this problem: Call for an ingathering of racially conscious whites to the Pacific Northwest, where they can leaven the local lump with racial self-consciousness.

  14. Alaska: Too cold and cut off. Too much of a colony economy.

    Idaho, Wyoming, Montana, the Dakotas: Land-locked. They could be the hinterlands of a Northwest Republic, but on their own, they are not viable.

    But all of this talk is premature. No place in the US at the present time is the right place for an ethnostate. Not yet. All specifically political change is premature, and I doubt that the conditions under which political engagement is likely to be profitable will not exist for a good 20 years.

    At least I hope not, because at the present rate, it will take us 20 years to lay the necessary groundwork for productive political engagement.

    How do we get there? We need to work in two areas: (1) changing consciousness, awakening our people, (2) building on-the-ground, face-to-face, real-world networks and communities.

    These are metapolitical activities, meaning that they are not politics, but they lay the foundations for politics down the line.

    They strengthen us intellectually and reduce the intellectual resistance of the enemy.

    They strengthen us morally and reduce the moral resistance of the enemy.

    They create a real community that can serve our people as the existing system breaks down. This real community can, moreover, serve as the seed of a New Order when the existing one rots away and finally collapses, perhaps from a good kick.

    The US Titanic has ALREADY struck the iceberg people. White Nationalists already know that the ship is doomed. We have limited resources and manpower. What is the best thing we can do with them?

    Hunter thinks we should buy a table in the ballroom and try to lobby the captain to change course when he walks by shaking hands and reassuring people that everything is all right.

    Harold Covington is trying to get some men together to commandeer a lifeboat.

    Unfortunately, somebody seems to have disconnected some of the wires in our people’s brains. How else to explain the fact that people who KNOW that our people are on the road to extinction obviously need something MORE in order to GET SERIOUS and actually DO something about it?

    Once a healthy person knows what the right thing to do is, he doesn’t need any additional reasons to act.

    Moreover, the existing racially conscious community is not big enough to fill the proverbial lifeboat, and in such cramped quarters, we would tear one another apart.

    So I am left hoping that the compartments hold and the ship does not sink for 20 years, because we need the time to figure out what brain wires have been disconnected and get them working again.

    Yes, it sounds like a farce. It is a farce. It would be funny, were the stakes something less than the survival of our race on this continent.

  15. I meant to write:

    I doubt that the conditions under which political engagement is likely to be profitable will exist for a good 20 years.

  16. This is all so speculative (necessarily).

    For one thing, there is no way to know what kind of collapse is coming, hence no way know for sure exactly what we should be doing in terms of time investment.

    Some observers I’ve read anticipate a sudden collapse where we go very quickly from day-to-day life as we experience it now to quasi-Mad Max conditions almost overnight. The System has so many balls in the air right now I don’t think a sudden collapse can be completely ruled out (global finance in crisis, world reserve currency issues, wars, Israel destabilizing the whole world, staggering US debt, the potential for terrorism at any time, massive unemployment and foreclosures, accelerating demographic change in favor of non-Whites, the list is just endless). If the juggler drops just one ball, they could all come down, easily.

    Also, if anyone is interested, the nightmare scenario for a sudden collapse is described here:

    http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/07/how_long_can_you_tread_water_b.html

    On the other hand, a lot of people have been talking about a quick collapse of the United States since the 1970s either from nuclear war or something else, and it hasn’t happened.

    Others foresee a slow deterioration of the United States over time. This scenario seems more plausible to me than a sudden collapse, and not because of wishful thinking. History shows that complex societies never “collapse” and disappear suddenly. In turn, this would suggest that despite WN wasting the 50 years and all the chaos still within our ranks today, we still have time to figure this out, but not much.

  17. Greg writes:
    Hunter thinks we should buy a table in the ballroom and try to lobby the captain to change course when he walks by shaking hands and reassuring people that everything is all right.

    I do not find this to be an accurate understanding of what ” Hunter thinks” at all.

  18. Greg Johnson wrote:
    So I am left hoping that the compartments hold and the ship does not sink for 20 years, because we need the time to figure out what brain wires have been disconnected and get them working again.

    Greg, you are a prolific writer, and I have enjoyed reading your comment. But with all due respect, the above quote is the direct opposite of what you should have hoped for, if you are truly concerned with the survival of America as a predominantly White nation. Taking into account how powerful, relentless, ruthless, and utterly determined the forces behind the drive for demographic change in America are, which will be all but complete in 20 years, it is pretty safe to say that there will be nothing left to salvage in 20 years from now. The best chance for the preservation of Whites as an ethnic community in this country, if it is not too late already, is the breakdown of the system not in 20 years from now, not in one year from, not in one week from now, but today. Unfortunately, that is not likely to happen – the tribe will see to that.

    As I write this, the words of Dr William Pierce pop up in my mind: If I could wrack havoc with the US economy to make White people miserable enough to wake them up before it’s too late, I would do that without moment’s hesitation.

  19. Ivan, I disagree. Whites will be a minority in this country in 2050. But even that is not the point of no return, because we are not going to vote our way out of this anyway. We do have time. Which is good, because we need it to organize.

    My hope: The present depression grinds on at least 10 more years, creating ever increasing racial polarization and also cutting down on immigration and actually forcing immigrants to go home. Ten more years of depression might push 2050 back to 2100.

    The collapse could come suddenly, like the USSR. But in that case, who would be organized enough to pick up the pieces? Not us. If the collapse comes too soon, whites will suffer more than non-whites.

  20. Nightowl: Respectfully, you don’t know what the hell you are talking about when it comes to Washington and Oregon.

    You wrote: “Oregon votes 70-30 for Pinkos in virtually every election.” No, it does not.

    The facts are:
    *The 2006 election for Governor in Washington was decided by less than 200 votes.
    *The 2010 election for Governor in Oregon was won by less than 1/2 of one percent.
    *The re-election of Patty Murray in Washington in the last election was so close it took days to finally call it for her. About 10,000 votes among 1.5 million cast is not “70-30 for pinkos” by any stretch of the immagination.

    The truth is that in statewide elections in both states, there is a paper thin Democratic majority, possibly enhanced by vote fraud, as was seen in the 2006 Governor’s election in Washington.

    * The Oregon House of Representatives is split exactly 50-50 between the two parties, there will be some sort of power-sharing control there. Which puts the lie to this claim: “The only Republican victories are in the sparsely populated Mormon areas on the east side of the cascades.”
    (No where near 50% of the Oregon house comes from East of the Cascades.)

    The WA-3 congressional district includes Vancouver, WA (Pop: 165,000) which is essentially a part of the Portland Metro area. We just elected a GOP Representative to replace the Dem incumbent, who had to step aside after calling the Tea Party protesters “brown shirts” after he was harshly denounced for supporting Obamacare and bailouts in town halls. WA-3 is not particulary rural, though it has rural areas, is west of the Cascades and doesn’t have a large Mormon population in it.

    You are right about this claim: “Oregon democrats have burdened the population with all kinds of petty regulations that get annoying very quickly ”

    And Oregon citizens have pushed back against the more annoying ones, including forcing the government to pay compensation to people who have been harmed by Zoning regulations.

    The truth is that Oregon is a microcosms of the USA as a whole, with strong divisions among the white majority. Some are quite liberal, let the liberal media set their opinions, are comfortable with a Jewish dominated political and economic elite running the state, and vote overwhelmingly Democratic.

    The others are natural-born conservatives, what small less costly government, don’t like illegals, want taxes and regulations decreased. The libs have the upper hand, but it’s a paper thin majority that is getting smaller each election cycle. Another 2 years of 12% unemployment and Oregon may well flip to the “Red” column.

    Washington voters soundly rejected by wide margins a proposal to put a tax on high incomes (over $400,000) which says a lot about the intelligence of the electorate here. This type of demagogury is standard fare for Dems everywhere, and ususally ganners majority support. Not in Washington.

    In summary your characature of WA and OR is wrong. It’s not Berkeley North, by a long shot. The conservative base is a lot bigger than 30%, and it is the libs who are stuck in their ant hive enclaves (Seattle & Portland) while the entire rest of both states consistently vote against them.

    Mormons are roughly 3% of the population in both state, so we’re not “Utah Jr.” either. (Wyoming, by comparison is 10% Mormon, and Idaho is 25% Mormon!)

    What is comes down to is which is more destructive to a state: 30% blacks or 50% white liberals? When it comes to politics perhaps the former is less destructive. When it comes to overall quality of life the latter seems much easier to deal with.

    Especially if you live out of the “Urban Growth Boundary” where the local authorities are conservative or libertarian in philosophy and the long arm of the liberal elite doesn’t reach.

  21. barb says:
    November 20, 2010 at 11:10 am

    Wyoming is the best choice. The bitter cold, the wind, the parch, it makes us cowboys. “Gotta be tough out here in the west.” We are Euros. We can handle the cold, and it has the advantage of keeping out the warm-climate-adapted riffraff, which evens our odds a might. And, point of fact, the summers are delightful. A/C is cheap because swamp coolers work well in the dry heat.
    Ag is impossible? Then how come our legislature is overwhelmingly dominated by ranchers? WY grows winter wheat, sugar beets. Longhorn steers are *adapted* to WY. We just grow Herefords and Angus because old habits die hard.

    Oil and gas? Dude, you minimize it, but oil and gas ARE our trump card. (And you forgot coal.) WE can be self-sufficient while everyone else grovels, begging us to share. With oil and gas, we heat our houses and pickup trucks. With oil and gas we farm that parched desert and build dams to store water. With oil and gas, greenhouses can grow what won’t outside in the cold. And as worldwide Peak Oil continues its relentless savaging, our power will only continue to increase.

    And the sparse population? That’s a feature, not a bug. We got no Big City, so no big-city-lovin’ parasites. No Blacks, no cockroaches and no Jews. Plus, leaves plenty of open land for Affordable Family Formation. WY has not suffered a housing bubble and bust because land was not constrained, so the bubble never blew. Just steady, reasonable growth.
    And as Hunter said, Wyomingites come the closest to already being WNs of anywhere in America.

    I’m not disparaging Wyoming in general, I personally think Eastern Wyoming around Cheyenne, Gillette or the Pan Handle of Nebraska around Sidney and Scottsbluff is some of the most beautiful scenery in the entire US. I absolutely loved that stretch when driving coast to coast. But I don’t see the region as economically viable in supporting a large population, unless one is independently wealthy I don’t think jobs are easy to come by. You know you are in a near frontier when you see the Giant Steel Gates the State Patrol uses to shut down the Interstate for days during severe weather. That part of the country is also nearly 6000ft above sea level and there is an atmospheric phenomenon that produces a near constant wind during the winter that gets into every creace and fold in your jacket pulling all the heat away that makes it feel like one of the coldest places in the nation, much colder than Michigan.

    I did get a kick about looking on the Rand Macnalley Map as I was driving across and saw a town called “Red Desert” comming up as I was smack dab in the middle of the state. I thought, “perhaps there’s a MacDonalds here for a quick burger and coffee?” As I approached the exit on I-80 I looked and there was only one single building in sight for nearly 10 miles in every direction. An old 40’s style gas station that upon closer look beared the sign “Adult Books” over it’s door. I just chuckled to myself that the entire town of Red Desert WY consisted of a single dirty book store.

    This picture — http://www.naturespicsonline.com/misc/SitesPhotos/wyoming.jpg –one of the posters put up earlier is exactly what the stretch of I-80 between Rawlins and Rock Springs looks like. I usually split off I-80 at Salt Lake Utah and took I-84 north to Portland, but one of these days I’d love to continue on I-80 from Salt Lake to Reno accross Northern Nevada as I hear it is even more desolate than WY and has a sort of stark beauty like Arakis from the Dune movies. Still though, I’d say Missouri would be a much more realistic state for the average Joe to find a job in a state not run by “Moonbeam” type left coast or Jew York City Democrats.

    Still though, moving away from your childhood home, friends, and family is not an easy thing to do. After the thrill of being somewhere exotic wears off you really do get homesick. They made a somewhat boring indie film a few years back called “Bodies, Rest, and Motion” in which a girl had an unhappy boyfriend who was always relocating all over the place. He somehow got the idea that “Butte Montana is the City of the Future.” If you’ve ever seen how run down the depressed mining community of Butte really is you know how foolish that idea was and when he was out running around the country his woman took up with some local boy who gave a speech about how happy he was to have stayed in the same place where he was born. The movie made the concept of migrating all around the place like this Covington advocates seem like childish pursuit.

    It also seems the states that are very conservative are the places that don’t attract migrants for the most part. Very Conservative places like Oklahoma, the rural deep south are where local kids who fancy them selves as “too good” for their environs and move to Seattle to become SWPL type coffee drinkers come from. You shut down the option of moving to San Fran’thithco and the guys in the “Up Your Alley Fair” would probably get stuck in the region they were born.

  22. Greg and my fellow Americans,

    Hope for whatever you wish, count on calculation whatever they are, do whatever you want but, please, do not give up your right to bare arms.

    ?????? ????? ??? ???? ? ???? ?? ????. ? ????? ???? ? ???? ?? ?? ???????? ? ?????? ?????.

    Whinger is good for he who has it. And God help he who finds himself without it in due time.

  23. “Where there are few non-whites, such as the Northwest, white consciousness is low. But if white consciousness were to rise at such a location, it would be the ideal location for an ethnostate since it would not require huge population transfers to bring about an amicable divorce between the races.”

    Where there are many non-whites, as in the South, white consciousness is high. But a white ethnostate is unlikely to emerge there because of the sheer magnitude of the non-white population, which, realistically, the white man will not be able to screw up the gumption to cast out. ”

    True. However ; the Whites in States like Alabama and Mississippi already know how to deal with their Black parasites. Whites, in places like these have already *been* overwhelmed – and have learned how to hold the line. Were is not for the Federal Leviathan, threatening imprisonment and execution (The Civil War, any-one?) – the Southrons already would have thrown off the Darkies.

    I live in a NorthEastern state that is largely White. Masses of Whites have never lived cheek-by-jowl with The Diverse, and only know what TalmudVision tells ’em. My immediate area is very working class, and very community-oriented. Many of the little towns, here where I type, and all around my State, consist of generations of families, and every-one knows one another, and knows every-one else. My fellow Whites are feeling the real-world effects the financial destruction of the USA. They are suffering. They are not “racist” – but they are clannish. Which is a good thing. They won’t need much convincing, to Do What Needs to be Done, when the Dark Hordes begin scavenging.

    50-100 miles South, and East, are wealthier “Liberal” university towns, and a few major cities, filled with Liberal Tolerant Whites, and their wildly diverse, competing, and mutually-loathing Minorities (The Whites of course, are completely oblivious to the acidic, dangerous hostility that “minorities” have towards other “minorities”).

    I see my turf as a rich soil, in which to foment Racial solidarity. Especially next year. So I’m not migrating ANYWHERE – unless I absolutely must. I am here, and I m going to stand MY ground. Cause *this* is where I was born. This is MY soil. That – and I intend to have a blast, when the Party really starts rockin’….I can feel it building. I know it’s building, cause I still have Uber Liberal White pals, from the Old Days (I mark time as BRA and ARA – Before Racial Awakening, and After Racial Awakening. ) – and they’re telling me that they can feel things building. Most of my pals from the Old Days have shunned me for my beliefs. They are now begining to call, again. Hmmm

    In closing – one of the most strident, semi-hysterical Racial Egalitarians I know, just admitted, last Saturday, that the relentless achievement gap in Blacks and Whites is due to genetics. This person still was insisting that “…it’s culture, and lack of education!”. A few thoughtful questions got her to admit it all about genetics.

    She gave up, all at once.

    I was shocked.

    It wasn’t really all at once, though. She’s got a small child, now, ya see. I’ve been hammeriing away this subject since before the tot was born. She was viciously resistant, and used to yell at me for my “racism”. I took her insults, and fury, and kept hammering away. She never wanted to *know*. Now – she has the Light of her Life to consider. She wants the very best for her very bright little blonde daughter.

    I provided all kinds of info, which she steadfastly refused to accept (but was absorbing all along, as her partner informs me) – until she had a reason to see the Racial Light. And good on her, for doing so – for her change of heart was for the very best reason. And now everything will change in her world….her partner is already with us.

    Why am I relating this personal anecdote? Because this is how things will happen. So stay where you ARE. Stop ceding turf, Whities O’ Mine. Work the ground where you stand. Til the soil by hand. Make the rocky places smooth and rich.

  24. “The American pro-White movement probably has the biggest assortment of self-serving assholes, nitwits, sociopaths, and bullshitters that the world has ever seen.”

    Mainstream politics is not much different – endless infighting and personality clashs. Most people just want to get on with their life and the 10% or so who get involved with politics have a disproportionate number of big egos.

    “David Frum explains how it’s possible for small committed groups to influence elections.”

    http://www.frumforum.com/how-to-hijack-a-political-party

    Worth reading to prove to yourself how few people you actually need to change the direction of a whole country.

  25. Jackson, I may have exagerated things a bit, but that is the effect of SWLP types relocating to Portland and Seattle. They hold the rest of the state hostage in the elections. If I recall, President Hussein got 58% of the vote to McCains 42% and that creepy jew Wyden did get an even greater margin of victory. I did post of how once one gets outside of Portland the towns are ordinary places. One phenomen I did notice is the Willamette Valley has all kinds of Specialy Agriculture like Fruits and Berries that require intensive labor and as a result a lot of the rural towns like Woodburn have been colonized by the Mexican farm workers. I have read how a lot of Portland residents who want to raise families move across the river to Clark County Washington because government is much more favorable there. The hippie types attitude towards Clark County is “oh, that place is for breeders.” My boss loved Bush and lived in Camas so I’m not surprised the Congressional Representative is a Republican. South East Portland around Hawthorne and 39th is ground zero for the Beatnik types and the mayor is a queer who wears horn rimmed glasses. Last I heard he had a sex scandal with a 17 year old boy that endeared him even more to the Hawthorne Street crowd. Politics is complex, there are Berkely type towns all over–like Madison WI, Boulder CO, Ann Arbor MI, Urbana IL. Some states go blue due to blacks and mexicans, others like Massachusetts and Vermont are less understandable as if whites kept their marbles they should have been able to get better representation than Barney Frank, Ted Kennedy, and Bernie Sanders.

  26. “She gave up, all at once. I was shocked.”

    It’ll be like the Soviet Union. For decades before the belief that held it together collapsed it was sustained by an ever growing number of people *pretending* to still believe in it.

  27. This is why Greg Johnson is wrong:

    (1) Twenty years ago, the time was right. David Duke (a former Grand Dragon of the Ku Klux Klan) was enjoying success in Louisiana state politics campaigning as an explicitly pro-White candidate.

    If Duke had not been carrying so much Klan and Neo-Nazi vanguardist baggage, he would have been elected Governor of Louisiana. The Duke campaign demonstrated the weakness of the GOP establishment all the way back then.

    (2) The Oklahoma City bombing knocked the wind out of the pro-White movement and destroyed all the anti-government sentiment that had been built up after Ruby Ridge and Waco. A clear example of how vanguardist activity (like the sort Harold Covington advocates) is counterproductive to White Nationalist ends.

    (3) There was no follow up to the Duke campaigns in Louisiana. David Duke demonstrated the success and potential of the “mainstreamer” approach in the Deep South states. No one came along and picked up the ball after he dropped it.

    Instead, the internet came along in 1994. For the last 16 years, White Nationalists have done almost nothing else but “spread ideas” on the internet, which is exactly what Greg Johnson would have us do for the next 20 years.

    (4) White racial consciousness is extremely high in the Deep South: Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, Arkansas, South Carolina, and Georgia. The failure of White Nationalists to organize the millions of people who are already explicitly pro-White reflects the sort of impractical, disengaged, fantasy-based thinking that dominates the movement.

    If White Nationalists can’t succeed in taking advantage of White racial consciousness in the Deep South, they will enjoy even less success in the Pacific Northwest, which is dominated by millions of SWPLs who live in the Portland and Seattle metropolitan areas. That the Pacific Northwest is even being proposed as a destination reflects the near complete absence of a sense of realism in the White Nationalist community.

    (5) There are far more non-Whites in Washington and Oregon than Wyoming.

    (6) Johnson simply doesn’t know what he is talking about. It would require an enormous population transfer in the Pacific Northwest to create a White ethnostate there – a population transfer of millions of White people who live west of the Cascades – who would certainly put up more resistance than transient Hispanic migrants in the Southwest and Southeast.

    (7) Johnson ignores the fact that the South is the only region of America that has ever seceded from the United States or has anything like an alternative sense of identity to fall back on. Even after the Civil War, the South enjoyed home rule for most of the twentieth century.

    There is no autonomous sense of identity in the Northwest. Southerners are a people who have lived in this region for almost three hundred to four hundred years. It is far more likely that White Southerners will rebel against the federal government than the SWPLs in the Pacific Northwest.

    (8) Demographics are not destiny. States like South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana are whiter today than they were in the past. Mississippi and South Carolina used to have a black majority.

    Johnson ignores the possibility that Southerners will lash out (something that is already happening) when they feel like they are under pressure. After the Civil War, the South created the Jim Crow system. Life was so miserable for blacks under Jim Crow that over half of them relocated to the North from 1880 to 1960.

    (9) Virtually all the action now going on can be found in Southern states like Arizona, Florida, and Texas. These states are already passing laws that will drive out the illegal alien population in due time. In states like Virginia and Florida, the population of illegals has started to decline.

    Where are they going? They are relocating to California, Illinois and the Northern states where they find a more hospitable welcome. They are going to Washington state which doesn’t even require an illegal alien to have a driver’s license to vote in state elections.

    (10) Plenty of White people already live in Alaska and Wyoming.

    (11) The Mormons colonized Utah. The LDS still dominate that state. There is ultimately nothing stopping White Nationalists from moving to Wyoming and replicating that model.

    (12) Any “Northwest Migration” would be similarly landlocked because of the demographic preponderance of SWPLs west of the Cascades. What’s more, if White Nationalists started a “rebellion” in Washington or Oregon, the locals would quickly invite the federal government to move in with a military crackdown.

    (13) The vast majority of Whites in Oregon and Washington have no sympathy for White Nationalism. This is not true of the Deep South or even states like Montana and Wyoming which are known for their anti-government streak.

    (14) It is ludicrous to suggest that “political change” is premature. That is a prescription for nothing but navel gazing. The White majority already wants to shut down legal immigration and secure the border.

    (15) 14 years of posting anonymous comments on the internet hasn’t succeeded in “laying the groundwork” for anything. Neither will another 20 years of internet posting.

    (16) The most effective way to change White racial consciousness is through polarization and direct action in the real world like we saw after the 2006 May Day rally in Los Angeles or more recently the federal government suing Arizona over SB 1070.

    (17) White Nationalists are unwilling to organize in the real world because of the existing taboos and the threat of employment discrimination.

    (18) Metapolitical activity that is actually helpful should be welcomed. This also can be done most effectively within the mainstream: Mearsheimer and Walt’s The Israel Lobby, Charles Murray’s The Bell Curve, Pat Buchanan’s Death of the West, Thilo Sarrazin’s book which changed the immigration debate in Germany, etc.

    (19) Greg Johnson’s hatred of America, obsession with European fascism, and his visceral dislike of Christianity is counterproductive and associates White Nationalism with various albatrosses we would be much wiser to avoid.

    (20) White Nationalists have been waiting for “The Collapse” to come for the past forty years. We should assume there won’t be a collapse and plan accordingly. Even if there was a collapse, there is no evidence that vanguardists would benefit from it.

    When the economy began to collapse in 2007, it worked to the advantage of Barack Obama and the Left. The resulting backlash worked to the advantage of the Tea Party.

    (21) If a collapse were to happen, we should be trying to position ourselves now as leaders within our communities. That’s another argument for working within the mainstream.

    (22) We can openly work within the mainstream to accomplish almost all our goals on the immigration front. That is the best use of our time, not navel gazing over obscure European fascists most of whom have been dead for fifty years or more.

    (23) Wyoming is a much more sensible destination for a Northwest Migration. A mere 6,000 White Nationalists relocating to Wyoming would result in actual representation in the Wyoming state legislature. That would draw attention to our cause and result in a BNP-style breakthrough of the media imposed isolation of White Nationalists. The subsequent publicity would result in far more recruits to the White Nationalist cause.

    (24) 6,000 White Nationalists relocating to Washington state would be a drop in the bucket in a state of 6.5 million people. It wouldn’t have anywhere near the same impact.

    (25) We already have over 90 members in the House Immigration Reform Caucus. What can the vanguardists point to? I mean aside from James von Brunn’s ineffective shooting spree at the Holocaust Museum in DC.

    (26) Living in a fantasy world is hardly activity that I would describe as “serious” or “effective” or “productive.”

    (27) We can’t afford to waste the next 20 years on fantasist schemes that have no plausible chance of success.

    (28) It sounds like a farce because that is an accurate description of your proposal.

  28. A quick skim of Hunter’s latest yields a count 11 straw men, non sequiturs, falsehoods, and sheer fantasies. I think it would be a great exercise in bullshit detection to throw this open to our able commentators. The one who identifies the most will receive a free copy of Revilo Oliver’s THE JEWISH STRATEGY.

  29. Winning in the Deep South (on the “mainstreamer” model) or in Wyoming (on the Northwest Migration model) is the equivalent of running up a hill whereas launching a successful IRA-style rebellion in the Pacific Northwest is the equivalent of climbing out of the Grand Canyon.

  30. Don’t forget false dichotomies and any formal or informal logical fallacies. Lapses of taste do not count. That would just be cruel.

  31. Hunter,
    Nothing you can say will convince HAC, or the others to change their mind, as they are already fully committed. So these arguments really are a waste of energy.

    If you are certain that Wyoming, or the South is the better option, why not organize it yourself?

  32. I doubt the Soviet Union will be the model for us. The Soviet Union disaggregated along ethnic lines into what amounted to previously established nations. The Soviet Union turned into Lithuania, Ukraine, Belurus, Georgia, Moldova and so on. There is no exact parallel for that here.

    Denise: “True. However ; the Whites in States like Alabama and Mississippi already know how to deal with their Black parasites.”

    Here in New Orleans we already had our dry run for the collapse with Kartrina. We learned some valuable lessons. First, you don’t want to be anywhere near Blacks when the lights go out. Not that anyone one in our movement needed empirical verification of that, but everybody was surprised at the complete break down of civil society and the rule of law within 12 hours. No one expected that. All of the pre-Kartrina emergency models said the authorities would have 48 hours before all hell broke loose. But no, New Orleans’ young Black male population didn’t hesitate; they went on the rampage immediately, robbing, looting and even shooting at emergency workers for kicks.

    Many Whites ended up not being paralyzed by PC anxiety though. At one point, for example, a massive gang of Blacks tried to cross the Mississippi river bridge from New Orleans into a nice White suburb on the other side of the Mississippi river, but were met by armed White police and ordered to turn back. When the Black mob didn’t turn back, the White cops fired some shots in the air, and then they got the message and went back where they came from.

    This is why I still think the Deep South has some potential for an ethnostate, despite the number of Blacks. A lot of people down here are already racially conscious, and willing to shoot first and ask questions later.

    Another factor we shouldn’t lose sight of either is that our only truly formidable adversary is elite Jewry. If for any reason elite Jewry can’t maintain its power as the US deteriorates, especially in the media, we will probably turn a lot of people around fast assuming we have organzied properly and people know about us.

    Without Jews or the Feds in the way, I am pretty sure Whites in the South could handle the situation. Many of the Blacks in Louisiana are concentrated in the city of New Orleans, and there are only four ways out of this city which is surrounded by a lake and a river. With those four ways blocked, much of the problem in Louisiana would be solved.

  33. I have to laugh at how some mainstreamers fancy themselves torch-bearers of common sense and factual reporting. The numbers will be follow up comments to Hunter’s talking points.

    1,3 & 4) If the U.S. South is such a boiling cauldron of white racial consciousness and anti-government sentiment one would think at least one successor to David Duke would have materialized and an embryonic ethnostate would be forming in at least one of the Southern states. That’s clearly not happening. I see the people of the South as passive racists who are acutely aware of racial differences but who will do no more than segregate themselves from blacks and illegals and complain from time to time.

    2) Timothy McVeigh was not a vanguardist white nationalist. He was simply an anti-government patriot with no strong racial opinions. Contrary to media spin and innuendo, his interest in William Pierce’s novel, “The Turner Diaries” was based on the anti-government, guerilla warfare aspects of it and not the racial message. If you wish to argue this point then read his biography, “American Terrorist” which is based on interviews with McVeigh himself and his friends and associates.

    There was no pro-white movement to speak of in 1995. Pro-white groups were on the far outer fringes of the spectrum and had nothing to lose by the OKC attack. The militia groups were all hat and no cattle. All the camouflage and anti-government posturing amounted to nothing as they lost their courage in the aftermath of the bombing.

    8) A. Inhospitable laws and threats of violence forced blacks out of those states. They certainly didn’t move to the North because of the great weather.

    B. How are Southerners lashing out? By voting for Republicans? I would hate to really get on their bad side.

    14) I’m not opposed to attempting political change but you’re not going into this with eyes wide open. It’s more like wishful thinking and a little fantasism of our own.

    15) Maybe not, but somehow the vanguardist WN agenda has worked its way into the mainstream. Early vanguardist sites railed against Jewish influence and illegal immigration when only “kooks” and knotsies (sic) believed such things. There’s still a way to go on the Jewish question but now most politicians put their careers at risk if they favor amnesty. That definitely wasn’t the case in the middle and late 1990’s and even the early part of the 21 century.

    16) Worse is better. More illegal mestizo immigrants behaving badly has opened up everyone’s eyes to the problem to the point that a political solution just might be possible. In the 1990’s you couldn’t bring the subject up without being called a racist and being treated to speeches that we’re all immigrants. The ill timed mass marches of the last several years by the illegals and their establishment allies has opened many people’s eyes to the anti-white and anti-American mindset of the “immigrant community”.

    18) Sure, once mainstreamers publish a book about something it leads to instant change. “The Bell Curve” came out in 1994 but we still have affirmative action and racial set asides. Most within the establishment condemned the book as “racist”. Disparities in test scores are still blamed on white racism and lack of equality. The book itself is too dry and technical to be read widely by the masses.

    Mearsheimer and Walt’s epic ‘The Israel Lobby” is more readable but has it weakened the Jewish lobby one iota? I think we all now the answer to that question. The Lobby dispatched a battalion of shabbos goys to denounce the authors as “anti-semitic”.

    20) A collapse may or may not be a good thing. It would at least offer whites the opportunity to defend themselves against the black and brown swine victimizing their communities without being hauled before a tribunal of cultural Marxists.

    23) 6,000 open and avowed WN’s moving to Wyoming at once would go over about as well as a fart in church on Sunday. I can guarantee a campaign of intimidation and harassment by the Wyoming powers that be with help from the feds. This sounds a little fantastic but I’ve learned never to question the reasoning faculties of a mainstreamer because they are always right no matter what.

    25) The ninety or so members of the House Immigration Reform Caucus have proven they’ll oppose and vote against amnesty. Great, that will buy us maybe 2-4 years at most. Will they end birthright citizenship, illegalize sanctuary cities, militarize the border or even work towards forcible deportation of illegals?

  34. If you are certain that Wyoming, or the South is the better option, why not organize it yourself?

    Probably because he doesn’t want to end up a Harold Covington copy crying in the wilderness. Literally.

    Wyoming is perhaps the only state left that could be gained “locally” given x,000 activists living there and working in close concert. But getting WNs to make personal sacrifices is just impossible. If we assume or conclude that Hunter’s quick Wyoming model is feasible – forget sustainable after coming to the attention of the media and government – and are unwilling to seriously discuss it as a fairly simple and straightforward plan of real-world action, we are faced with the fact that WNs care more for the continuance of their own lives as they are than any real-world action. They want it to come to them, hence the faith in catastrophes and electoral upsets. Anyone have trouble believing WNs are self-serving individualists who spend all day fretting over folk and yet are willing to overlook a daring idea with more real-world application than ANY of the others we’ve seen? This isn’t their fault. It is how class functions. I bet you Pastor Lindstedt would move out to Wyoming, but no movement could survive association with him however distant, not even a rumor. Abnormals would make the change. Normals like to stay put, and dream of far-off revolutions (epistemological even!) orchestrated from behind their keyboards. No one is willing to let the issue dominate his life as being Jewish dominates a Jew’s life, without even having to decide on it. Whatever the Jew does is a vehicle for his jewishness; he can no more avoid being the Jew in the woodpile than we can spend the day not breathing. For the WN, being white, it isn’t instinctual, which is why we have to come up with brazen unworkable schemes for the political (or epistemological!) recapture of the masses. No such danger with Jews, despite all the claptrap about the “dangers of Reform Judaism” or out-breeding. Big lolz to that one in specific.

    It is a shame we are all so different and hard to motivate. But that’s the nature of this thing. The bridge from virtual to actual is a mirage.

  35. I can guarantee a campaign of intimidation and harassment by the Wyoming powers that be with help from the feds.

    You are right, but I’d almost rather try than wait for more Mexicans to move there and make things worse-is-better. Oh well.

  36. 1,3 & 4) Unsurprisingly, Mr. Dithers chimes in to browbeat White conservatives for their failure to act like explicit White Nationalists. Of course every time he does this he fails to mention that explicit White Nationalists themselves almost to a man are unwilling to stand up for their own beliefs in reality. If explicit White Nationalists won’t act on their own ideas, and this includes Mr. Dithers, why should White conservatives – many of whom are not even explicitly White – be expected to do so?

    David Duke lost in Louisiana because of his Klan associations and that damaging photo of him in a Nazi uniform. Duke himself has admitted this. The failure of the Duke candidacy in Louisiana was due to his own personal flaws as a candidate, not the model or the message he was running on. That model was successful and it could have produced electoral results if other White Nationalists in this region had been willing to follow in his footsteps.

    Why hasn’t another explicit White Nationalist run a similarly successful campaign in the Deep South? Because the White Nationalists have spent 97 percent of their time since 1994 posting radical anonymous comments on the internet. The vanguardists are still addicted to this sort of rhetorical radical masturbatory activity.

    2) Timothy McVeigh was a vanguardist who was affiliated with the Aryan Nations/Christian Identity wing of White Nationalism. We was a frequent visitor to a White separatist community in Northwest Arkansas. McVeigh was also a fan of William Pierce and The Turner Diaries. This was documented at length in the Leonard Zeskind book.

    It is also untrue that White Nationalists had nothing to lose by Oklahoma City. That is absurd. Mark Penn was on cable television just the other day describing how OKC destroyed the militia movement, revived the Clinton presidency, and led to a massive crackdown on White Nationalist groups.

    (8) A. Arizona and other Southern states are already in the process of creating a new set of Jim Crow laws to make life uncomfortable for Hispanics. It is already having the intended effect: illegal aliens are leaving Arizona and relocating to California and states like Illinois.

    B. Disenfranchising blacks through tough anti-crime sentencing and driving out Hispanics through a myriad number of state laws and local ordinances that make it hard for illegal aliens to attain employment.

    (14) I have spent the last three weeks pointing to the victories that our side is winning. In contrast, vanguardists have nothing but the James von Brunn shooting to point to.

    (15) I can’t think of any aspect of vanguardism that has now become mainstream. There has been some “mainstreamer” influence on the mainstream. Pat Buchanan admitted to adopting David Duke’s platform.

    (16) Worse is not better. It is “worse” in California than anywhere else. Moonbeam is back as Governor. The state is broke. Los Angeles is no longer an American city. Half of the children in California public schools are non-White. This hasn’t led to any vanguardist renaissance in that state.

    South Africa is the ultimate proof that worse is not better. In a country where blacks are 90 percent of the population, Whites put up with a level of violent crime that should drive any sane population to revolt. Instead, Whites in South Africa have been cowed into submission.

    In America, over 35,000 White women are raped by negroes every year. Where is the proof that “worse is better”? Where is the massive vanguardist organization that should reflect the hundreds of thousands of White women who have been raped since 1964?

    As for immigration gaining traction, that was due to the efforts of people like Lou Dobbs, Tancredo, and Buchanan in the mainstream who hammered away at the issue for years. Then the issue caught fire with the conservative base which revolted over the Bush amnesty.

    (18) The Bell Curve did far more to inform educated White Americans of the truth of racial differences in intelligence than idiotic Neo-Nazis ranting and raving in vBulletin cyber ghettos ever did.

    Similarly, The Israel Lobby sparked a national discussion over Jewish influence over American foreign policy. It was widely read and distributed … unlike the Fuhrer of Kirksville whose decade of rants against the Jews never produced so much as a blip on the national radar screen.

    (20) Vanguardists like George Lincoln Rockwell were talking about the imminent collapse of the United States in the 1960s. They have talked about it for the last 40 years and it still hasn’t happened. In fact, the only time the system really seemed to be in trouble – after Bear Sterns, Lehman Brothers, the stock market crash, and $4 gas – it worked to the advantage of Barack Obama.

    (23) 6,000 White Nationalists are not going to move to Wyoming. If they did, there is nothing the federal government could do to stop them from voting and taking over part of the Wyoming state legislature.

    (24) At least 70 of them support ending legal immigration, militarizing the border, building the fence, and ending birthright citizenship. Steve King is going to introduce the birthright citizenship in January.

    What will vanguardists be doing in January? Undoubtedly, what they have done for the last sixteen years, which is nothing but bitching and complaining about how awful things are on the internet.

  37. Mr. Dithers,

    How about a compromise? You and Johnson can have the “worse is better” states like California, Massachusetts, Hawaii, and Vermont.

    We can focus our attention on the “better is better” states like Georgia, Alabama, Virginia and Iowa.

  38. Wow Dithers, you really gave Hunter a shellacking there. You sent him reeling. Contact me via. Counter-Currents, and I will send you a copy of THE JEWISH STRATEGY.

  39. Wow Dithers, you really gave Hunter a shellacking there. You sent him reeling. Contact me via. Counter-Currents, and I will send you a copy of THE JEWISH STRATEGY.

    You cruising the comment threads here, Johnson?

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