The Southern Nationalist Flag, or Black Cross, was designed by Southern activists in Augusta, Georgia in the summer of 2013. It feautures a St. Andrew’s Cross (the black “X”), the basis for several of our ancestral flags in the British Isles, a few State flags in Dixie (Alabama, Mississippi, Florida and the former flag of Georgia) as well as the Confederate Battle Flag. It has since been adopted by much of the Southern Nationalist movement and has been used at events, rallies and protests across the South. Where ever people are at the vanguard of advancing Southern interests you will likely see Southern Nationalist Flags.
I expect a lot of pushback on this but we’re going forward with it regardless. It’s needed. Thanks for promoting it, HW.
Did your buddy make that flag?
A big X. It reminds me of the negro symbols of the early 90’s during the Malcolm X revisionism.
You should have stuck with the stars and bars. That flag looks like a child made it.
I like it.
Excellent flag design selection, from my pointof view! It appears you beat all other regional white secessionists to it. Good reasoning on flag design and use, good post.
The Welsh nationalist flag Yr Eryr Wen is also starkly black on white: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Wales_Army
Another black and white flag of a suppressed ethnic region: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Piran's_Flag
We like a Celtic red dragon flag, Y Ddraig Goch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbBGWR4VL58
Another black on white design that someone has suggested: A smiling black face, with white eyes and teeth showing. on a white background with the word Dixie in black letters below.
Blecch.
As a student of heraldry, and with some generalist knowledge of banners, flags (etc.) as they have been used in the Church and in Christendom, may I venture to say that is the UGLIEST excuse for a flag I’ve ever seen.
You need COLOR, and you need identification with more than just ‘black/white/Dixie’ cross.
Also, the speaker should get his eyes surgically altered, to appear more ‘open and trusting’ rather than looking like he’s got Sinoid ancestry. In this day and age, visuals matter. Even to one’s face. Sorry to say it, but there it is.
No excessive “pushback” here, Palmetto Patriot, just a friendly-intended comment: I listened to the entire video but came away unconvinced that this “X marks the spot” flag has the necessary visual impact its designer thinks it will have. It’s the same situation that Harold Covington and his self-designed “Northwest Republic” flag has: he personally designed it without first opening it (in competition with other designs) up to any kind of vote by those expected to use it. In the case of Covington’s flag, it’s a rip-off of the Cascadia flag and also closely mimics an African flag (!) so he definitely made a big boo-boo that he’s just too embarrassed to back out of now.
Likewise with this new Southern Nationalist flag: what competing flags did it go up against? No, I’m not talking here about existing Southern flags, like the various Confederate ones. I’m talking about fresh designs. And I’m also talking about designs created by other than this flag’s designer. I know this much: I would want to see and compare and discuss the merits of at least a dozen designs for such an important symbol as a Southern Nationalist flag before deciding on which one I would carry into battle.
Anyway, perhaps others here agree. I’m just not stirred in my heart by this flag. If anything, an anonymous competition should be waged (to avoid favoritism in voting) in order to see just what kind of design most Southern nationalists would best rally around. Once the winning design was chosen by vote, then and only then would the designer’s name be revealed.
Do any others agree with this idea?
Ok, I just don’t get it.
What’s wrong with the confederate flag?
It is already widely known, is a proud symbol of “hate”, people understand instantly what it means and what it represents, why a new flag?
I like the black and white flag for the same reasons that Jon and Michael were inspired to create it:
1.) First, red, white, and blue is too closely associated with the French tricolor, the US flag, and republican ideology.
2.) Second, we are rejecting the US flag and everything it stands for in favor of the more conservative, hierarchical society that we seek to create. The “Southern heritage” movement is backwards looking and cares more about defending the symbols of a dead state than their actual substance.
3.) Third, the Confederacy is a major part of our past, but it was really only four years of our past, and too many people in the Southern movement identify the South with the Confederacy. We don’t want to be seen as backwards looking.
Having said all of that, I really like the Bonnie Blue Flag, the Stars and Bars, and especially the Third National Flag of the Confederacy, and I would be comfortable using any of the flags at our events. I think the modern Southern Nationalist movement does need a symbol of its own though.
4.) Finally, Alabama Über Alles!
Bonnie Blue forever!
Hunter, it’s tough enough trying to explain ideologies and get your point across to people, why develop a new symbol that must be explained, and acts instead as yet another barrier to understanding the cause.
The Confederate flag states everything in one easy to recognize symbol. I really don’t think it in any way can be confused with the American Flag, and, I don’t think it just represents the 4-years of the confederacy, but also the 150 year history of the South, it is the Flag of Reconstruction, it is the Flag of Jim Crow, it is the Flag of Anti-Federalism, etc.
The movement IS backward-looking by nature, as you want to un-do something which has been done, you want to undo Federal repression of the states, and re-do Jim Crow. I think everyone wants to go back to the government we had either 50 (Undo civil rights), 150 (Win Civil War), or 250 (undo United States) years.
That being said, some of the other Confederate flags could be used and they have explanatory power, and are are at least semi-recognizable, like the Culpepper flag, or the very simple Bonnie Blue mentioned before. I think one of my personal favorites is the South Carolina flag, with the Rattlesnake wrapped around the Palm tree.
Gotta agree with Fr. John and Sean; that “flag” has as much cachet as as the Walmart logo (which someone else once said looks suspiciously like the terminal end of the human alimentary canal). But then, since elementary schools in much of the country have stopped teaching cursive writing, perhaps this is a glimpse of the average person’s “signature” in the future? Then too, looking at your new flag, the average American negro will take it for a new traffic sign; “no Whites allowed”. BTW: guy in the white shirt sounds like your average White guy from New Jersey, although I take it he was raised in the South?
I still like the simplicity and starkness of the SN flag introduced here by Jon and Michael. But remember the real reason for the use of diagonal BARS rather than a vertical, Christian CROSS, in the original Confederate “stars and bars” flags was that “good southern” Jews in authority wouldn’t accept any flag design with a CROSS.
A black six-pointed star on white would gain you maximum support and acceptance.
No responses yet on the smiling blackface design suggestion?
Any 1930’s aviation buff will immediately recognize that symbol as the insignia of Franco’s air force in the Spanish Civil War.
I’ve been looking at pictures of vintage airplanes since I was a model building kid so I don’t associate that symbol with the South. But then Franco’s forces were often referred to as “the Rebels” and he was revolting against Marxism and anti-clericalism. So whatever twirls the prop of your Fiat Cr.32.
Boring uninspiring flag. Many people will be reminded of Malcolm X and be confused as to your intentions.
After giving it some thought, that symbol might not be such a great idea if you plan on making common cause with Basque or Catalan nationalists. Franco came down hard on the regional independence movements in Spain even if they did not have an explicitly Leftist orientation. The Basques are still unhappy about Guernica.
http://southernnationalist.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/southern-nationalist-flag.jpg
Here is something that someone put together and sent to me this morning.
I utterly reject the bigoted comments of Mosin and Fr. John concerning the new SN flag.
The X symbol of the flag is called a saltire. Contrary to Mosin’s ignorant statement that the CSA had to use the saltire because “good southern Jews” wouldn’t accept a vertical Christian Cross, the saltire cross is an ancient Christian symbol. It would be just as offensive to the Jews as a Latin Cross. It’s also called the St. Andrew’s Cross because St. Andrew was killed on one. It’s also the flag of Scotland. Since most Southrons are Scot-Irish, including yours truly, (my Sephardic ancestors intermarried with Clan O’Neil), it’s an appropriate symbol for our cause.
Fr. John’s comment about the SN flag being ugly betrays an ignore of saltire flag history. Go to this link and you will see a plain saltire flag is a thing of beauty. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saltire
@ “…second, we are rejecting the US flag and everything it stands for in favor of the more conservative, hierarchical society that we seek to create…”
Idk—- we already live in a heirarchical society, it’s just one with leadership millions do not agree with. But they are on top. They collect TAXES AND MORE TAXES, and they pay for their open borders development, lots of wars, and much more.
There is a very clear “Elite.” Your t.v. even calls them an “elite.” (Just b/c you don’t think they are an “elite” or one you like, doesn’t mean they aren’t an elite or that they don’t feel that way about themselves as they are collecting your wages, (ie, you are a slave).
So what is not heirarchical about the u.s.?
A black and white Saltire is a nice idea and packs some punch, imo
and George,
very few involved with the southern movement seem to have historical roots in the south. It’s sort of strange and funny, interesting… idk.
Like reading the latest Greg Isles novels—- he’s a transplant German who sets his books in the south. Very sad. No southern writers are really from the south nowadays, either (but the south SELLS, that is the funny part). The south has cache, people want to buy books set there, etc. But the books (because the people aren’t from there) just regurgitate the t.v. cliches.
And anyway, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED to talk about THE REAL SOUTHERN EXPERIENCE (not even in novels.) THAT IS UNDER “the Silence.”
What it feels like to be in a place 380 YEARS, then have tens of thousands of foreigners come overnight, on your tax money, and turn the area into something that feels foreign, looks foreign, sounds foreign (foreign accents, languages, styles). The end of the beautiful slow charm of the southern yards, the flowers, the native plants.
The novels do not discuss THAT. No sense whatsoever of the policy-oriented “displacement.” No sense of the loss, nothing. Whole cultural products show AS IF THEY WERE BY SOUTHERNERS when they are not, that put the real southern experience UNDER ERASURE, under “the Silence,” the voicelessness.
Seriously… genocide is bad. People should be ashamed.
1.) First, red, white, and blue is too closely associated with the French tricolor, the US flag, and republican ideology.
Southerners have been living under red, white and blue flags for more than 300 years; the Union Jack, the Stars and Stripes and the Stars and Bars. Red, white and blue are the historic colours of the South and the colours that most Southerners identify with. Why would you want to tamper with a longstanding Southern tradition like the national colours? It seems unduly provocative to say the least.
2.) Second, we are rejecting the US flag and everything it stands for in favor of the more conservative, hierarchical society that we seek to create. The “Southern heritage” movement is backwards looking and cares more about defending the symbols of a dead state than their actual substance.
Propaganda tip: call the US flag “Washington DC’s flag”. It associates the flag with *the* place that people love to hate, and not with generic ‘America’.
3.) Third, the Confederacy is a major part of our past, but it was really only four years of our past, and too many people in the Southern movement identify the South with the Confederacy. We don’t want to be seen as backwards looking.
No, you don’t. You want to be seen as the man with the plan going forward, not some bitter, old Civil War buffs pining for the days when you kept your darkies down on de old plantation. Not backward, but forward! Not downcast, but uplifted! (like Che Gueverra’s eyes in the world’s most famous photograph)
Having said all of that, I really like the Bonnie Blue Flag, the Stars and Bars, and especially the Third National Flag of the Confederacy, and I would be comfortable using any of the flags at our events. I think the modern Southern Nationalist movement does need a symbol of its own though.
You’re going to a demonstration in Uvalda, Georgia, right? Maybe you should bring this flag:
“In 2002, Sonny Perdue was elected Governor of Georgia, partially on a platform of allowing Georgians to choose their own flag in a state referendum. He authorized the Georgia legislature to draft a new flag in 2003.
The General Assembly’s proposed flag combined elements of Georgia’s previous flags, creating a composition that was inspired by the Confederate First National flag, the Stars and Bars, rather than the Confederate Battle Flag. Perdue signed the legislation into law on May 8, 2003.[10]
The 2003 flag legislation also authorized a public referendum on which of the two most recent flags (the 2001 and 2003 versions) would be officially adopted as the flag of the state. The referendum took place during the state’s March 2, 2004 presidential primary election. If the 2003 flag was rejected, the pre-2001 design would have been put to a vote.[11] The 2003 design won 73.1% of the vote in the referendum.[12]
The current flag resembles the first official Confederate flag (“The Stars and Bars”), while also using some elements of the 1879, 1902, 1906, and 1920 state flags.”
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/54/Flag_of_Georgia_%28U.S._state%29.svg/800px-Flag_of_Georgia_%28U.S._state%29.svg.png
You guys should make more use of state flags: your loyalty should be first and foremost to your states. Contrast them with Washington DC’s flag. The state flags are also non-controversial, so why not take ‘intellectual ownership’ of them for your own purposes/nefarious ends?
4.) Finally, Alabama Über Alles!
That’s the spirit.
@Palmetto,
Here is something that someone put together and sent to me this morning.
White for Europeanism and black for nationalism, is that right? Not black nationalism, surely. More like a ‘word up’ to fascism/nazism I guess. Man that’s just awful. It’s like painting a target–literally, a giant X–on your entire incipient political movement, and for no reason at all. Do you want to spend all your time on the defensive about the colour scheme of buddy’s homemade flag? Or would you rather just focus on the issues that matter to conservative and nationalist white people in the South? No serious sovereigntist in Quebec, Scotland, Catalonia, Flanders or anyplace else would be caught dead with a flag like that. You already have a flag, a cool looking one with a palmetto and a crescent moon. You should use that instead.
Be sure to bring the Georgia flag to Uvala. And also bring the SC and AL flags to fly in solidarity with your GA homies.
I salute the Confederate flag with affection, reverence, and undying remembrance.
To the bottom of my heart. Where is the meaning and the sense of gratitude and Being Blessed in the sight of this- or any, new flag?
I’m not sorry, but I say that with all respect to your efforts and good intentions.
Maybe I’m just spoiled to goose bumps.
Yes, Sam, we’re really Malcolm X supporters. You found us out. We’re a bunch of White Christian Southerners who love Malcolm X. And we’re going to show our love of him by going to a small, mostly White Southern town to protest Third World immigration. It all makes sense, doesn’t it?
lol
BTW, among our other plans are to go to Greensboro, NC and protest the Black crime and mob violence there. We’re going to do this because we’re Malcolm X supporters.
PalmettoPatriot says:
August 2, 2013 at 12:59 am
‘Yes, Sam, we’re really Malcolm X supporters. You found us out. We’re a bunch of White Christian Southerners who love Malcolm X. And we’re going to show our love of him by going to a small, mostly White Southern town to protest Third World immigration. It all makes sense, doesn’t it?’
I did not infer you were X supporters.
I was talking about the perception of the average Joe.
Malcolm X shirts were very ubiquitous several years ago and are are often worn by in your face niggers to this day.
A large black X on a white shirt is not uncommon.
Stephen Dalton wrote: “I utterly reject the bigoted comments of Mosin and Fr. John concerning the new SN flag. The X symbol of the flag is called a saltire. Contrary to Mosin’s ignorant statement that the CSA had to use the saltire because ‘good southern Jews’ wouldn’t accept a vertical Christian Cross, the saltire cross is an ancient Christian symbol.”
I was well aware of the “Saint Andrews Cross” symbol that the diagonal bars may be taken to represent — and that the Swastika is also a Cross variant, sometimes. But you betray either ignorance, or more likely, unwillingness to admit (I wonder why) that the diagonal bars were used because the standard, vertical cross symbol was religiously controversial.
“Propaganda tip: call the US flag ‘Washington DC’s flag’. It associates the flag with *the* place that people love to hate, and not with generic ‘America’.”
Good tip, Jeppo. Some around here have taken to calling it “the Obama flag”, and the Gadsden flag, “the real AMERICAN flag”.
Stephen Dalton, what do you think of a black six-sided STAR on a GOLDEN background (instead of the black SALTIRE on the white background) to represent the genius of the “Golden Circle” slave-based culture and multiracial caste elitism?
BTW, among our other plans are to go to Greensboro, NC and protest the Black crime and mob violence there.
When is this happening?
Third, the Confederacy is a major part of our past, but it was really only four years of our past, and too many people in the Southern movement identify the South with the Confederacy. We don’t want to be seen as backwards looking.
The Confederate flag is a symbol of our people far more than it is a symbol of the CSA. I like this new flag but I don’t want it to replace the Confederate flag.
Remember that my original comment was favourable. I LIKE the black diagonal cross on white design as is.
“six-sided STAR” should have been: “six-pointed STAR”.
Re the cross: in hoc signo vinces / en toutoi nika :
I was going to point out it reminded me of the Cornish flag, but nagent beat me to it.
Mosin, your comment about the CSA adopting the saltire to avoid offending Jewish feelings is unfounded. I did an internet search and found no proof for your silly claim. The saltire, as I have already stated, was an ancient symbol among Christians. The Jews would be offended by any Christian symbolism, so your remark about ‘avoiding offending Jewish feelings is complete poppycock, as is your statement about the six-pointed star on a golden background representing Golden Circle slave culture.
About Malcolm and the X—
The X is deeply associated with northwest euro areas. Wasn’t that just an attempt to appropriate it in the first place? Opposition is ALWAYS appropriating symbols and trying to make them “theirs.” It is a main tactic of putting a people’s symbology UNDER THE SILENCE. It’s like the u.s. “Elites” just doing a fascist (militarist-corporatist-governmental liaison move) to simply PRINT everything in the u.s. in a FOREIGN LANGUAGE.
Can YOU EVEN IMAGINE going to China and PRINTING EVERYTHING in Japanese? LOL
Why isn’t that Genocide?
The St Andrews’ Cross on the Scottish Saltire is the chi of the ancient Christian chi rho symbol. On the saltire it is blue. For the flag of SN – perhaps white (as in white homeland).
The Dixie flag was a tricolor – white, red and blue. Perhaps red and blue backgrounds. Or perhaps gold and blue backgrounds reflecting the French heritage as much of Dixie was Louisianna Purchase.
Or perhaps gold and blue backgrounds reflecting the French heritage as much of Dixie was Louisianna Purchase.
We are predominantly a British-descended people. Changing our colours to honour the French, whose genetic imprint on Dixie is minimal, would be a mistake.
Stephen, you may be weak on research skills, and prone to assume you already know it all and that others are ignorant.
First of all, I only SUGGESTED the flag design of a six-pointed star in a golden circle or golden background. to represent “Golden Circle” slave-based multiracial elitist culture, as well as the smiling black face on white design. I did NOT imply that any such flag has ever EXISTED.
In regard to the history of the Confederate flag designs, I am surprised you didn’t already know, and were even unable to find the facts. “Southern” Talmudism requested that no unambiguous Christian symbol appear on the flag, and so “the saltire of heraldry” (not the Saint Andrew’s Cross) was substituted “because it did not stand out so conspicuously as if the cross had been placed upright thus” and was “Heraldric than Ecclesiastical, being the ‘saltire’ of Heraldry, and significant of strength and progress”. Quoted: William Porcher Miles, chairman of the Flag and Seal Committee of the C.S.A. Otherwise the flag would have used the traditional (Saint George’s) Cross.
I still like the black diagonal bars, or saltire or Saint Andrews cross on white design submitted by Michael and Jon.
…the BETTER design of an upright, white cross, on a black background, being already taken, as I said before, for the flag of Kernow.
“The Jews would be offended by any Christian symbolism”
However, that the degree of offense is much less with some symbolism than others, is the point. The “X” in Xmas for example is much less offensive than the “Christ” in Christmas, and a HERALDRIC “saltire” is considerably less offensive than a Cross as such.
Well Mosin, I did a little more reading and yes you were correct about the Jews objecting to an upright cross. However, I found out some Protestant sects did too. Did you know that or did you leave that out on purpose? Dang, where’s that pilgrim church when you need it!
Yes, it is true some Protestants don’t desire crucifixes, flags with crosses, crosses in every form everwhere — nor icons, “relics”, steeples, fancy temples and robes, bells, candles, etc. However, I don’t think THEY were responsible for swaying the C.S.A. flag decision. In any case, thanks, Stephen, for considering the matter and agreeing very nobly.
Jeppo’s comments are spot on! State’s rights, all the way!
I agree, Jeppo’s comment is right-o, good sense, worth re-reading.
Mosin, I didn’t “agree” with you. I conformed my views to the truth. The fact that some Protestant sects side with the Jews shows the influence Jews have on ‘Christians Reform Movements’. Do these folks belong to a ‘pilgrim church’ that even abhors the use of a simple, unadorned cross in art or decoration? If so, that shows the Jewish influence on your ‘pilgrim church’.