Ethnonationalism vs. Eurasianism

Alabama

I’ve followed this exchange at Counter-Currents and Radix Journal.

I’m left wondering: how would “ethnonationalism,” as Greg Johnson construes it, be applied to the United States? Specifically, would this entail a future White ethnostate renouncing its claim to, say, the Mississippi Delta, Florida, or California on the grounds of the large non-White population that exists there?

In the South, should we fall back to the pristine whiteness of West Virginia? Is this really possible? Could a White ethnostate in the Heartland allow a weak “black ethnostate,” an American version of Haiti, to control the Mississippi Delta? Would a White ethnostate really alienate its own coastline and allow it to become a geopolitical playground for foreign intrigue to satisfy a universal abstract argument?

Are there any coastal cities in the United States which lack a large non-White population? Seattle is 66.3 percent White. San Francisco is 48 percent White. Los Angeles is 28.7 percent White. Are White Nationalists just going to give up those cities? Would White Nationalists act any differently than Putin has in Crimea?

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54 Comments

  1. If one were to pursue an intermediate phase between the current melting-pot and partition, it would be a libertarian society where all races were legitimate but the government would not be in the business of telling whites how to live. Without handouts, the dark skinned people would leave, especially after enduring countless “micro-aggressions”.

    Paradoxically, an all white nation would necessarily have elements of socialism.

    From a geographic standpoint, the northern Pacific Coast and parts of the Texas Coast Line and parts of the southern Atlantic Coast Line are white enough to make a legitimate claim.

    A back-of-the-envelope method of dividing the country would be to give blacks 10% of the states, hispanics 10% of the states, white liberals 20% of the states.

    Blacks:

    Alabama, Louisiana, Georgia, Mississippi, and South Carolina.

    Hispanics:

    Arizona, New Mexico, Texas from San Antonio south, California from San Francisco south, Nevada

    This is far too simplistic, but there will come a day when the rank-and-file white “conservative” who would recoil at the thought of partition, will think such an arrangement an impossible dream compared to the hell of genocide.

  2. So what happens after they get those states? control of them immediately returns to the very same groups which are controlling and exploiting them today. And, said groups would continue to attack us.

  3. Yeah, if we give up our cities then the immigrants will what more, this goes to the North West Front movement, I really don’t think the Southerners can just pack there bags an head to the North west, Will there be enough housing to support the immigrating white white population? Will there be enough resources to support us there? Wont the Federal Government (witch is the most anti-white government on earth run by Jews) do every thing in its power to stop us? Drones anyone ?

  4. I was wondering how southern nationalism addresses similar problems in Atlanta, Charlotte, Birmingham, etc.

  5. A-ism v B-ism? I wouldn’t worry about it, because ideologies are for followers. If you need to format your thinking according to someone else’s taxonomy, then you do not have the moral courage that true power depends upon. If you really wish to pursue the road to independence, then you throw away the books and think for yourself, independently. Nations are a form of life. Their basis for existence is without limit, whatever the mind can conceive, whatever chord the spirit can emit that will resonate in the hearts of men and will bring the harmony of spirit that unity requires.

    Ethnicity will probably continue to be a primary factor in the formation of cultures and nations, but I would suggest to you that this is a false cause and a red herring. I would remind you that your greatest danger most likely comes in the form of someone who looks just like you. Furthermore, I would suggest to you that the problem with niggers and jews is not the color of their skin, their genes, their IQ, but rather the fact that they are so immersed in their own ethnic groupthink that they cannot interact in a wholesome way with anyone other than their own kind.

    Even though it is most likely that you will be able to make common cause with white, European, Christian, possibly only Southern people, it would be a very poor strategy for you to select on that basis. If you do not recognize the number of snakes with precisely that pedigree, you are seriously mistaken, and you will pay for it eventually. Better to assemble your forces on the basis of honor and courage and respect, wherever you find it, and with that power that will naturally follow, take whatever part of the earth that you need to build your nation.

    In the end, power is its own justification. If you can create it, then you can have it. You can keep it if no one can take it away from you. There is no more legitimate basis for sovereignty. Laws do not make nations; nations make laws. That is the natural order of things.

  6. The moderator: do not post the previous submission — I’ll correct the typo in the last paragraph in a moment and re-submit. Thanks.

  7. After a 1+ year of close watching OD, I stopped following it a week ago after concluding that the non-silent majority here is immune to unpleasant truths. Different people have different views but keep this in mind if you think about building the white majority: irrationality revolts.

    This is for those who have found my past opinions useful:

    http://www.counter-currents.com/2014/03/white-nationalist-delusions-about-russia

    This section is good: Putin’s Russia is Nearly as Anti-White as the Liberal West.

    I don’t have a firm opinion on the Russia ancient history’s part of the article — that history had been written by less ancient historians and then re-written on demand: nobody knows for certain e.g. the pre-1600s events:

    Racially and culturally, the forerunner of Russia was the Grand Duchy of Moscow (1263–1547) which later became the Tsardom of Russia under Ivan IV (The Terrible), and not Kievan Rus as has been claimed by Russian historians since the time of Catherine the Great (who, by the way, was not Russian).

    But for what the author says on the modern history, including the important Putin’s “New” Russia section — without parsing every statement made, I give my general approval.

    Whatever the author’s name is, the article seems to be written by a Russian, so grounded in reality it is. “I am so proud to be 100% Russian.”

  8. Oh please, have you looked at Russia?

    The new Czar has ice blue eyes. Like Adolf, as Hillarycunt said.

  9. plekhanov says:

    ‘http://www.counter-currents.com/2014/03/white-nationalist-delusions-about-russia’

    Everyone interested in gaining further insights and understanding on Putin, Russia, Europe and Ukraine should read this article.

    It really is a must read for those of us yearning to navigate through all the
    misconceptions, distortions and utter BS that passes as truth.

    Then read it again and again to get the full import.

  10. What the nation building geniuses fail to realize is that yes Alabama, Mississippi, South Carolina etc have the highest population of blacks as a percentage- but all 3 of those states combined have less blacks than NYC has alone.

    Take California for example – 39 million people – 7% black = 2.73 Million blacks

    New York – 19.7 Million people – 18% black = 3.55 Million blacks

    Alabama – 4.8 million people – 26.5% black = 1.27 Million blacks

    Mississippi – 2.9 million people – 37% black = 1.07 Million blacks

    …..See how this works?

    Why would we give up the most fertile land in our country, which is what our ancestors died for, to a bunch of blacks who live mostly in other parts of the country? Why is Mississippi and Alabama singled out when there are states with nearly 4 times as many blacks in them?

    This ‘Alabama/Miss/SC/Georgia’ have to take the country’s blacks is a Yankee nationalist perpetuated lie – we already tried to take care of the blacks in our own states and were not allowed to by the rest of white Amerika. Quit with your fantasies of deporting your blacks to the South – we don’t want them.

  11. Still, the result of this is that Ukraine now has a Jewish prime minister who is a lackey of Washington, and who is going to plunder the economy on behalf of Western investors. The present crisis over Crimea will become a sideshow after the IMF gets done imposing its “austerity” program on Ukraine.

    Obama, John Kerry, Lindsey Graham, John McCain, George Soros, the entire US Mainstream Media, and the neocons are all for it. That tells me everything I need to know.

  12. That’s a good article, Plekhanov, thanks for the link. There’s some fascinating history there about the Euro-Asian origins of the Russian people and the Muscovite state. However I think the author is too harsh with the Russians in general, dismissing them as barbaric Asiatic hordes totally incompatible with the civilized white West.

    If we start writing off entire European nations for their mixed origins, where does it end? Should the Balkan nations and Greece be considered non-white because of their long occupation, and consequent genetic and cultural imprint, by the Turks? Should southern Iberia and Sicily be cast out of the West because of their partially Moorish roots? I say no.

    Finally, and most importantly, real Russian White Nationalists, who are as much a minority in Putin’s Russia as their counterparts are in the West, are vilified as “Nazis” and are persecuted far more harshly than in the liberal west.

    This fact can’t be stressed enough. There are supposedly hundreds of Russian WNs jailed on trumped up charges, doing the hardest of hard time in the medieval Russian prison system. What do you think the odds are of a racialist and secessionist demonstration in Russia, like the one Hunter is attending today, going off without a hitch? I would say almost no chance: they would all be rounded up by the cops, severely beaten and hauled off to jail at least temporarily, with the ringleaders looking at long-term incarceration.

    The article also looks at the power and influence of the Jews in Putin’s Russia, and the delusional WNs in the West who refuse to acknowledge it. But I’d like to focus on a different angle:

    Therefore, any consistent and honest White Nationalist should support the current Ukrainian revolution. If Ukraine has any chance to join the larger white European family, this is the time. White Ukrainians are breaking free from the Russian (non-European) yoke and joining their white brethren in the West.

    …..

    Moreover, western White Nationalists should not underestimate Ukrainians (and by extension other Eastern Europeans), and they should not overestimate the brainwashing power of the Jew-led EU. Having closer ties with the West and even joining the EU does not automatically mean Ukraine will be flooded by hordes of non-white immigrants or gays will be marching on the streets of every big city.

    Many Eastern European countries, including the post-Soviet republics of Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, joined the EU in 2004. However, those countries remain predominantly white. So far, they have been completely spared the demographic changes experienced by western countries through non-white mass immigration. Eastern Europeans are sufficiently traditionalist not to permit their countries to be flooded by non-whites.

    In addition, non-white immigrants find relatively poor Eastern European countries unattractive destinations. They look for easy money, welfare, preferential treatment, an opportunity to behave insolently with impunity, etc. If they feel that the local white population will not provide these opportunities to them, they will simply avoid those places.

    Non-white immigrants also avoid relatively ethnocentric societies. Eastern Europe (especially Poland and Ukraine) already has a widespread image as “racist” terrain, to be avoided. The same incentives can be observed within Germany. The former East German territories have the reputation of being populated with “racists” and dangerous for immigrants. As a result, Turks, blacks, Arabs, etc. are simply afraid to go there. Thus even large cities like Leipzig and Dresden continue to have almost exclusively white populations.

    Exactly. Eastern Europe is not Western Europe. It is still overwhelmingly white and there is not a shred of evidence showing that this is going to change any time soon, if ever. In fact the Eastern Europeans, along with Western European nationalists, may turn out to be the saviours of the EU, re-purposing it from being a liberal globalist project to a pro-white civilizational bloc. That’s why Ukraine belongs with Europe and not Eurasia; to help this process along.

  13. >>Better to assemble your forces on the basis of honor and courage and respect, wherever you find it, and with that power that will naturally follow, take whatever part of the earth that you need to build your nation. <<

    Ethno-nationalism can't now exist with borders and a government. Nations under empires haven't historically had their own borders or governments, yet they survived. We have to organize ourselves without these things.

  14. Plekhanov is on target. The article he linked to shows why my maternal Finnish grandpa told my mom and her siblings “Never trust the Russians!”

  15. Tell me about it, that Jew John Kerry or Kohl, whats to sanction Russia even thou Putin has sad, that if Russia is sanctioned, he will cut of the US dollar as Russia’s reserve currency

    http://www.dailystormer.com/warmongering-jew-pig-john-kerry-to-putin-you-dont-invade-a-country-on-completely-phony-pretexts/

    http://scgnews.com/russia-threatens-to-drop-the-dollar-and-crash-the-us-economy-if-sanctions-are-imposed-obama-signs-sa

    Because wen need more wars for the Yankee empire right?

  16. @CrimsonTide: Aren’t there EVEN MORE WHITES at the north? And note that Mississippi is already almost half African, by those same statistics, which count non-Anglo Celtic, non-Germanic Hispanics as whites.

  17. ‘read it again and again to get the full import’

    After a hundred readings even the most commonsensical will become self-hypnotized.

  18. Counter-‘currents’, otherwise known as counter-commonsense, and Counter-Christian…. The article is sophistry.

  19. “Why is Mississippi and Alabama singled out when there are states with nearly 4 times as many blacks in them?”

    You are cherry picking your states. The fact remains that a majority of blacks in the US (something like 55%) live in the 11 states that comprised the Confederacy. If you add the states that wanted to secede (Missouri, Kentucky, and Maryland) but could not due to federal force majeure then the percentage becomes even higher.

    Another misleading statement is that in Northern states with large black populations you are likely to rub shoulders with a lot of blacks. This is not the case since the North is extremely segregated with most blacks confined to ghettoes in the big cities. In the Deep South there are blacks living practically everywhere and you see them everywhere.

    http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2012/10/09/776px-new_2000_black_percent_custom-48761e129bc528cd9c7dbb6dba06a663e6140f97.gif

  20. jeppo, on March 8, 2014 at 12:11 pm:

    I think the author is too harsh with the Russians in general, dismissing them as barbaric Asiatic hordes totally incompatible with the civilized white West.

    I wish it were not the case but having grown up there I know the brutality of one Slav brother to another and won’t disagree with the article’s author. And to do a business with a Russian, take his word as a promise? In many cases you can, but the life will teach you soon that in as many cases you can’t.

    “The Russians” the West sees — or wants to see — are often the upper-crust individuals. And very often, with a mix-in of European (e.g. Jewish) blood. They are not in their native environments, too, which is a behavioral factor. I love these better Russians myself, but I am afraid the whole territory is not made of the upper-crust people. Then remember the huge Muslim areas, with their current population and its growth. And you can hardly know the Caucasus people’s control of many Russian spheres of life and communities.

    For a European or American white to bet anything on Russia is insane. Love it from afar, compare its leaders favorably with others — but do not strive to be in its orbit, do not long to be close to it. As a community, an ethic and geographic factor, she is not your friend, and won’t be in your lifetime.

    Stephen E Dalton, on March 8, 2014 at 2:12 pm

    Plekhanov is on target. The article he linked to shows why my maternal Finnish grandpa told my mom and her siblings “Never trust the Russians!”

    People who know do know. Being familiar with the Russia’s history, including the two recent wars with Finland, I can’t disagree with your grandpa.

    Reagan tried “Trust but verify” and judge yourself whether that worked out to America’s advantage.

    Lest I am considered anti-Putin here, a link to an article most of you will like:

    http://www.achgut.com/dadgdx/index.php/dadgd/article/putin_is_a_thinker._obama_is_an_actor

    In many way, I like Putin, but the path to the Western whites’ liberation is not going through Russia.

  21. And, the Finns? I’d a think dee relationship wit de Swedes wassa problem. But he hi.

  22. Erm…

    No one is asking Putin to marry my daughter.

    Instead we are discussing a reasonable border for Russia, one that is in everyone’s best interests.

  23. Yes Mosin there are more whites in the North and more blacks in many Northern states than Southern ones. We should deport all the blacks and Jews to live on Manhattan Island and they can devour themselves since they love each other so much.

  24. So you say that it’s 55% vs 45% blacks in the North vs the South. Ok well enough, we will deal with our blacks and you deal with yours. What’s that? Whenever we try to deal with our blacks the rest of white Amerika cries for them and descends upon the South like a plague of locusts? The only reason we have to rub shoulders with them is because you lot forced integration on us.

    The solution here is to have the South secede and we will handle our black situation. A WN America can also deal with their black population. since as you say, basically half of them live outside the South. Easy peasy.

    But just quit with your fantasies of shipping all your blacks here, it comes off as arrogant and dismissive to the very people who have been warning you for 200 years about the black problem.

  25. My guess is that Black’s maybe undercounted by 50% or more. Do you really think Black folks are going to answer census questions…

  26. Earl I think this is a common tactic with Jews, not sure about blacks. Blacks seem to be very willing and able to fill out forms for the government. Jews on the other hand say they are less than 2% of this country and like, .0005% of the world yet you can’t throw a cat without hitting a Jew. I think they purposely do this to infiltrate society among other things.

  27. “The only reason we have to rub shoulders with them is because you lot forced integration on us.”

    I didn’t force integration on anybody and opposed the 1964 Civil Rights Act which denied everyone the right of free association and anyhow y’all have been rubbing shoulders with them ever since the plantation owners brought them here. LOL

    http://img2-2.timeinc.net/ew/dynamic/imgs/080617/hattie-mcdaniel_l.jpg

    BTW, I have yet to see on this site any cogent plan to deal with Negroes other than the old standby “send them back to Africa” should the South or anybody else manage to secede.

  28. Rudel, on March 9, 2014 at 1:55 am: BTW, I have yet to see on this site any cogent plan to deal with…

    1. Make Generic American Party (GAP, see VDare) the reality. Yes, with Jews in: no chance to make this happen without including the patriotic ones. 2. Make the GAP stand for whites’ interests the way other ethnic lobbies do. 3. Overwhelm the existing political process by the number of whites acting as a united force. 4. Get the political power. 5. Get the judicial power. 7. Enforce the laws without ethnic preferences. 8. Eliminate all ethnic preferences everywhere. 9. Re-establish and enforce the freedom of speech and association. 10. Cut certain public funds.

    After #10, the system will clear itself fast, and there will be no need to send anybody anywhere other than those who are in the country illegally — a high number, a major balance factor. The closed border is a pre-requisite for any plan to have a chance to succeed.

    Hard and unlikely, against some ingrained dislikes — but achievable if started not too late. There are no practical alternatives, and even this opportunity will close in no more than a generation: the white children schooled today will not grasp or support what the current adult whites will.

    “Demography is the destiny”. The demography can be controlled by the consolidated white (including the patriotic Jews) majority. And so, the destiny can be, too — in a humane, sympathetic way.

    Whites’ unity and closed borders.

  29. No Jews. Sorry – they have a country to go to which was bought and paid for with 100 million+ white Christian lives.

  30. plekhanov, there is no ‘patriotic’ jew. There is only one nation for the jew -theirs and Abraham’s, not ours.

  31. Hunter Wallace, on March 9, 2014 at 4:14 am: Yankees won’t support a GAP.

    You have a better — a working — idea?

    Read Nicholas Stix at VDare about the NYC processes under the new mayor. The Yankees there will be put against the wall and have to choose between A and B for the sake of their children. If you are A, why are you pushing them to B?

    I, a Yankee in your definition, would hesitate to support the crazy, hate spitting Southern whites who can’t see how repulsive their rhetoric is for the whites outside their habitat. You know, I can deal with individual Jews all right — there are ethnic groups much harder to deal with, including my Slavic brethren Ukrainians. And now I am beginning to doubt that I would be able to live comfortably around the Southern Whites. Your hatred to me — the real Russian — not a mythical one a thousand miles away — would be so strong that you would thump me in no time as another Yankee. You’d thump me and then be thumped upon by the hordes. Everybody wins.

    CrimsonTide, on March 9, 2014 at 4:15 am: No Jews. Sorry – they have a country to go to…

    You won’t get to decide that. You may wish anything you like: there are powerful forces working against such views, they are currently numerically and intellectually superior, and they are at the power’s levers. The physical danger comes from the hordes and you won’t be able to withstand them without allying with Jews who face the same very dangers as you but are more afraid of you because your kind spits out anti-Jew hatred and the hordes work their way with a timid smile and a kind word. Love wins, you lose.

    NYYankees, on March 9, 2014 at 4:21 am: there is no ‘patriotic’ jew.

    A single counter-example will prove your assertion wrong, so here: please search for “Full disclosure” at

    http://www.vdare.com/articles/the-first-amendment-is-dead-in-america-michael-weaver-yet-another-railroaded-political-pris

    Now please tell us that Nicholas Stix is not patriotic. Or at least, that he is doing less as a white interests’ defender and patriot than e.g. you.

    • Yeah, secede.

      We would be infinitely better off here without the Northeast. The idea that those people are going to come to their senses is refuted by the last 200 years of history.

      Worse is better? In Massachusetts, Yankees elected Obama and thought he was so great that they reelected him over two Yankees. They want to make things worse than they are now.

      Southerners can’t have any confidence in any “Generic American Party.” There is no evidence that the Northeast will ever be content with anything less than more equality.

  32. Hunter/Brad, you and yours need to stop demonizing ‘yankees.’ There is widespread misconception among southerners about who we really are. I have come to realize that young’un’s, like yourself and the under, say 33 crowd, have little idea who *yankees* are. You have been brainwashed by the jewmedia’s poison.

    I have a ‘yankee’ friend who can date almost to the day (literally within a two week period) in I think 1983 when jews started an anti-german rumor that spread like wildfire among especially blacks in NYC. I was just in middle school then, but I remember a significant shift transpiring right around that time in terms of how the media began depicting both whites and blacks (and society in general). It was at the close of the 70’s, turning early 80’s, that affirmative action, however ill-conceived in it’s original form, turned rancid to the point of total putrification. It was also then that the jews, and their black lackeys, orchestrated a shift in the portrayal of both the race issue generally, and of whites in entertainment, especially TV and film.

    1979 was the year in which Electric Horseman (Robert Redford and Jane Fonda, Willie Nelson…) was a hit movie and The Holocaust was a TV miniseries (this was right before the early phase of cable TV where only 13 channels were available, forcing an audience in a way not possible today). I cite the contrast because the former marked the end, both within the film and without, of a frontier for us; it’s about an ex-rodeo star who bucks the entertainment industry and sets a prize thoroughbred loose out west:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmDGrapbb1k

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0079100/plotsummary?ref_=tt_ov_pl

    I watched this as a child, sitting home in the dark ages of ‘cable tv’ when HBO and then Showtime were the first and only home movie channels. The thoroughbred was poisoned and endangered, like our people and our natural environment would soon be. I saw it probably in 1980 or ’81 on HBO; The Holocaust broadcast right in my parents’ living room in 1979, filling my part germanic mind with questions like, ‘is grandma a nazi?’

    There’s no question that this shift was engineered quite adeptly by TPTB, mainly jews, to usher in an era of anti-white. Before that 3-4 year phase, northern whites watched movies like Electric Horseman and dozens and dozens more movies in the 60’s and 70’s (replayed for me on cable) which glorified the struggles of southerners (Sonny Steele is the ex-rodeo star who speaks in a southern twang). Wikipedia movies about the american south and you’ll see the biggest hits catalogued by the decades. If you recognized many (and I’m not expecting the young’uns to) you’d perceive the shift, which pivoted around the year 1983. After that films set in the South became mostly focused on either total comedy to the point of mockery, or on the Noble Negro’s foibles. I don’t think there was a depiction of a southern white male of any gravitas or even pathos after that time.

    TV was even worse in terms of the shift, from the 70’s entering into the mid-80s and on, but I’ll desist in expounding any more on that for now. My point is that a) the jews used white people, especially men, up, as heroes and sympathetic protagonists till they had put in place the foundation of their eventual lie about our people and b) northerners like me were not only not raised by our families and communities to admire and love (and occasionally fail to understand within our own Whiteness) our southern brethren – our tribe and ‘race’ – but also to celebrate their likeness (and our commonalities) in popular culture. The 33 and unders probably know little of this. I’d expect the middle aged and older to sense our differences more as ones of intimacy and frictions within our tribe, rather than in the stark and contrived contrasts the jews tried to couch them in. Mostly the jews connived to collapse all of us into one dehumanized blob of evil whitey, a shadowy profile which neither they nor blacks have ever been willing to actually flesh out. As long as they could Critically Race Theorize – erode our humanity and eradicate our histor(ies) – they could demonize us.

    But that was them, not us ‘yankees’ who only recognized our essential communal Whiteness in the true reflections of *ourselves*.

  33. I messed up a key phrase, please delete the extra *not* in this sentence for my above post:

    “northerners like me were not only *not* raised by our families and communities to admire and love”

  34. As a Russian you should know the death and destruction of the Bolshevik Jews who continue on their white genocide to this day, just more under cover. Southern whites are the most hospitable on the planet and the nicest people you can generally find, hence the term ‘Southern Hospitality’ – why do you think we would hate you so? Do you find others don’t like to be around you?

    Are you Jewish yourself? I know many Slavs have Jew blood and this would help me to understand your insistence on them being in a white country of our choosing? If they have a 100% pure Jewish homeland where we are NOT allowed to immigrate to, why can we not have our 100% Southern/European/American homelands? Jews are a culture within a culture – it doesn’t work, we want homogeny.

  35. I do feel for the Yankees who are awake to the problems that 90% of their neighbors are not – really I know a lot that I like very well. But I also know that they have voted and pushed for things that are only detrimental to not only the South but to their own white brothers and sisters up North. Look at the voting numbers, they don’t lie. Those are not mysterious votes that came from nowhere – those are your fellow whites voting that way and they have been voting that way for 200 years. They are literally voting you out of existence.

    I’m not sure the best thing to do at this point in regards to conservative Yankees because y’all are vastly outnumbered and your own WASP/Celtic race is dwindling to nothing. I’d recommend an escape plan because it’s not likely to change in the future and I truly would hate to see y’all on the news in some commie antifa terror attack.

  36. Hunter Wallace, on March 9, 2014 at 6:08 am:

    Yeah, secede.

    Is it doable? Crimea will most likely succeed in its secession from Ukraine because she is not trying to become independent but rather join the giant Russia, which is currently providing substantial support in all ways to the Crimean folks — majority Russians there, at that.

    Just today, Ukraine cut Crimea’s bank system off the Ukraine’s one and blocked all Crimean accounts in the Ukraine banks. Are the Crimeans hurt? Hardly so: the authorities are swiftly opening the accounts in the Russian banks, with the green light shining brightly for them. There will be no delay in paychecks or pensions paid. More than that, Russia promised a four times increase in the social spending per a Crimean, compared to what they had in Ukraine. Whose loss here?

    Another news today: the Ukrainian railroads stopped selling ticket to Crimea. How very horrible, tsk-tsk.

    And maintaining the public order on the territory? All these polite people with heavy armor, friendly to the populace?

    You’ll have the same good things happening to you in the South after you declare the independence, no doubt.

    We would be infinitely better off here without the Northeast.

    Not indisputable but it would be your choice and your life. The problem is, you won’t be given a chance to try. Being sandwiched between North and Mexico will make it hard for you to even start being independent.

    • Dixie isn’t remotely comparable to Ukraine.

      Ukraine is a poor country. Dixie is now the size of the Northeast and Midwest combined. We have the largest economy of any region of the United States. The Sunbelt is the US industrial and energy heartland.

      To put this in perspective, the Bahamas is an independent country. It is a mosquito compared to Florida. We don’t need Yankees for much of anything around here.

      • The modern South is nothing like the Jim Crow South.

        Politically, we don’t need the United States anymore. We already have a free trade agreement with Canada. There’s no reason why we can’t have the same relationship with the Northern states. Canada isn’t ruled by Washington.

  37. CrimsonTide, on March 9, 2014 at 6:20 am:

    As a Russian you should know the death and destruction of the Bolshevik Jews

    I know more about it than you could imagine. The history is terrifying and my learning is not over yet.

    Southern whites are the most hospitable on the planet and the nicest people you can generally find, hence the term ‘Southern Hospitality’

    Speaking from the personal experience: the Southrons are polite and smiling but closed, blocking out an outsider — the hospitality is shallow. But you have your reasons. (I studied the Civil War and switched my views from the brainwashed North’s supporter to the strong opposite.)

    why do you think we would hate you so?

    Because I am a Yankee for you and dare to think differently, not bundling all Northerners and Jews in one big bad ball? Or perhaps because I don’t watch football?

    (But Marty Robbins, Tom T. Hall, Waylon Jennings, Johnny Cash, Bill Monroe and their likes are my heroes. How I wish the South were able to preserve that legacy.)

    Do you find others don’t like to be around you?

    Probably the opposite.

    Are you Jewish yourself?

    I am not aware of any Jewish progenitors in my family tree. But who really knows, in the melting pot of Russia? I probably have some Mongol blood — who wouldn’t, coming from the East-to-Kiev lands? This is not a factor in my existence. I am just striving to be fair and help make my posterity’s life tolerable.

    I know many Slavs have Jew blood

    That’s the problem with us the Slavs, which I’ve tried to highlight in my recent posts here. Nobody can be sure if a Slav is a 100% Slav. As I said here, “A 25% Russian in the USA is probably 25% Jewish.” It’s not a slander, it’s the reality. But for the purposes of classifying me, I am 100% Russian with some ancient Mongol blood added centuries ago, most likely.

    and this would help me to understand your insistence on them being in a white country of our choosing?

    They won’t go anywhere just because you want them to go.

    If they have a 100% pure Jewish homeland where we are NOT allowed to immigrate to, why can we not have our 100% Southern/European/American homelands?

    That’s a terrific debating point, which I fully support. But I am trying to bring you to the reality: they are here and they will stay here, in no smaller numbers. Don’t fight the reality — use it.

    Jews are a culture within a culture – it doesn’t work, we want homogeny.

    Not all our wishes come true. Not all their wishes come true, either. No reason for trying to lose a war if you can’t win one small battle. Accept the no-win-this-battle situation, avoid this one battle and move on to figure out how to win the war.

    I want my grandchildren to be safe and live in a prosperous first-world country, speaking one language, having the freedom of speech, thought and association, under the rule of law without ethnic preferences. I want them to cherish Marty Robbins rather than rap. I don’t see a Jewish presence as an obstacle to this dream. (In Russia, the Jewish contribution to the traditional Russian culture is indisputable.)

    CrimsonTide, on March 9, 2014 at 6:29 am:

    I do feel for the Yankees who are awake to the problems that 90% of their neighbors are not – really I know a lot that I like very well.

    Thanks (no irony)!

    But I also know that they have voted and pushed for things that are only detrimental to not only the South but to their own white brothers and sisters up North.

    That is, unfortunately, very true.

    Look at the voting numbers, they don’t lie.

    Exactly: compare the results in NYC with upstate NY (they are talking about splitting the state now, like they talk in CA.)

    Another key state, MA: compare the elite areas with the ones further from Boston (but not the lost cities near major highways.)

    Of the smaller states, NH and MN are being quickly subdued by the immigration injections, which impacts the patterns, too.

    But the elites are meeting the hordes face to face now, and it will change the perception around the Harvard Square — give it a bit of time. Visiting some places close to where the elite live, I see the terrifying demographic changes in what previously seemed like a white dreamland to me. Give it just a bit of time and the Jews will join you, trying to protect their children from the menace they will be now feeling on their own skins (read Stix at VDare).

    At that point, you don’t want to reject the reinforcements running to you.

    Those are not mysterious votes that came from nowhere – those are your fellow whites

    Not “my” fellows, but I know what you mean and am ashamed. But there is more racial contagiousness there that meets the eye, and in time it may show up to our advantage.

    I am familiar with a number of Jews — I don’t remember any sympathetic to the hordes. The idiot W. pushed many Russian Jews over into the Democratic camp. That may be true for other Jews, too. Let’s be less idiotic in selecting the leader. McCain in 2008, picked by the Southern Republicans over Romney was a major mistake, now hard to mend.

    voting that way and they have been voting that way for 200 years. They are literally voting you out of existence.

    True. But try to offer better leaders than McCain and Bushes. Making the MA Romney the GOP candidate for Presidentials in 2008 would have made a huge difference. Now we’ll have at least eight years of this regime.

    I would be thrilled to have the AL Jeff Sessions as the 2016 Presidential candidate — it might change the disastrous voting pattern among the Yankees that you’ve observed.

    I’m not sure the best thing to do at this point in regards to conservative Yankees because y’all are vastly outnumbered and your own WASP/Celtic race is dwindling to nothing. I’d recommend an escape plan because it’s not likely to change in the future and I truly would hate to see y’all on the news in some commie antifa terror attack.

    The escape plan that I suggest is to soften up the anti-Jew stances and not fear to coexist with them. The best tactics fot today is — pardon the repetition: 1. GAP supported by the white North and South and not repelling Jews. 2. Jeff Sessions as the GAP presidential candidate in 2016.

    And if this doesn’t help, we are all lost, you and me. But fortunately, not yet.

  38. CrimsonTide:

    1. Are you located anywhere near t-town?

    2. Re. jews, Yankees, blacks: I am absolutely with you on sentiment. But designating those attributes as the primary criteria for discrimination is both morally and strategically unwise. Those are shallow, superficial characteristics and wisdom asserts that the Truth is rarely that easy to find. One obvious problem is shown when you consider who would NOT be caught in that net. There plenty of white, southern, Christians who will betray you in a heartbeat and whom you would be foolish to accept as your ally or friend.

    Rather, compatibility should be judged based upon a person’s values and beliefs, and discrimination should be based upon observable behavior as a reflection of those values and beliefs. (Note, I said observable behavior, not what someone says they believe in.) One question would be, does a person have any competing group loyalties that would make them untrustworthy or your confidence? There goes 95% of blacks and probably 75% of jews. Do they rely on the mainstream media as their primary source of information? There goes 80% of Yankees, and probably an equal number of white southern Christians. But the quality and potential of the remaining candidates are vastly improved, and you have the possibility of finding some good, loyal, real friends in unexpected places.

    Consider some specific examples. Liberal, progressive jews are not even in the picture. But, say, what about the people over at Breitbart.com? They have created a buzzing hive of conservative thought, but it doesn’t take long to see that they are long on promoting Israel and rooting out anti-Semitism. In other words, they are jews who have insinuated themselves into the conservative agenda for the purpose of shepherding it away from a recognition of the “jewish problem” and in favor of continuing support for Zionism. They are not your friends. But what about the Mad Jewess? (If you are not familiar with it, go have a look.) She and her friends are forthright about admitting to the evil present in mainstream Judaism, support white identity, and support white nationalism. But she also seems to reserve the right to discuss this issue to herself and is hypersensitive to others raising the question, and that makes her an edge case. Then there is Jew Among You (on the blog roll above), who is quite frank about discussing the behavior of jews, and also is a white nationalist and race realist. It was at that site where I first learned about The Shocking Jewish Role in Slavery, which, if it is true, is a real eye-opener and extremely important information that every southern nationalist should know about. In presenting this information alone, this guy has done a real service for SN and, Hunter Wallace, why aren’t you promoting that information here?

    In other words, having some nuance in your attitudes will make you more attractive to the kind of support that you need and less vulnerable to attack. If your cause is based upon values and behavior, then people can still call you racist, but the claim is much less credible.

  39. Hunter Wallace, on March 9, 2014 at 3:37 pm:

    We have the largest economy of any region of the United States. The Sunbelt is the US industrial and energy heartland.

    I know: you explained it all excellently about a year ago, in the OD and CR blogs. But the South doesn’t have an independent banking system, right? Most of the people’s savings are under the federal control, right? You don’t have an independent communication structure, and how the Internet behaves when you have declared, is an open question (see today’s http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2014/03/09/ukraine-computers-targeted-by-aggressive-snake-virus/).

    And this is just the economics. If you survive ten years as an independent South, you will be all right. Not obvious that you can be self-sufficient in the critical first year or two. I expect many people in the critical management positions, the transplants, will be soon quietly sabotaging you. I.e. if you manage to get to the point of declaring.

    Why not to try to influence the broader scene, the USA, the election results, before you decide to make your dangerous jump? Won’t it help you to have Jeff Sessions as the USA President?

    We don’t need Yankees for much of anything around here.

    This may, to some extent, answer this question:

    CrimsonTide, on March 9, 2014 at 6:20 am: why do you think we would hate you so? Do you find others don’t like to be around you?

  40. Plekanov,

    Get back into the mix over there.

    You appear to have all the solutions.

  41. NY Yankee,

    NY/NJ can be incredibly provincial. You site jewish-media changes in black-white race relations, but that’s been going on 200 years (and more). Also, there are hardly any jews in the country. Catholics and jews (many) landed at the same time, and in particular, fight each other for control of all the fat tax money they have gotten up there, through centralization.

    Then the people are bussed out, (by the tens of thousands, not even knowing they are policy=oriented incentivized to leave EN MASSE and destroy other cultures around the country).

    A NY-NJ person, raised in the psychosis, AND VERY USED to grotesque tax practices (and often having public jobs, etc, etc.) are just so happy to pay 2K a year for tax rather than 10K, that they are highly instrumental in jacking the Americans taxes up (for instance.)

    OFTEN they HAVE NEVER IN THEIR LIVES taken a real walk on PRIVATE PROPERTY. All they have ever known for any form of recreation is PUBLIC PARKS, and they don’t (therefore) know anything at all usually about the concept of private property (even though they think they know more than all the stupid rube americans all around them)

    They usually know none of the land appropriations history, or fights in the rest of the country.

    You can walk across NYC in an hour.

  42. Hunter,

    “I’m left wondering: how would “ethnonationalism,” as Greg Johnson construes it, be applied to the United States?”

    I imagine it would look something like this:

    http://allnationsparty.com/?p=57

    Precise borders are a fools errand at the moment, but there can be no doubt of two things:

    1. The existing United States has many different ethno-cultural regions

    2. Those regions act as the cores for potential new nation-states.

    “Specifically, would this entail a future White ethnostate renouncing its claim to, say, the Mississippi Delta, Florida, or California on the grounds of the large non-White population that exists there?”

    You’re assuming here that a future White ethnostate would be continental in scale. Even the Pacific Northwest project seem to have its eyes only on the land that makes up the existing Northwest United States. There are 3000 miles separating Maine from SW California, and close to 5000 miles separating Seattle, Washington from Miami, Florida. It’s not necessary for White people to control every single inch of all that land.

    “In the South, should we fall back to the pristine whiteness of West Virginia?”

    Wouldn’t that be up to West Virginians to decide? In other words, if West Virginians don’t consider themselves ethnic Southrons anyway, than they are of no concern to Southern Nationalists who want an independent Dixie.

    “Could a White ethnostate in the Heartland allow a weak “black ethnostate,” an American version of Haiti, to control the Mississippi Delta?”

    Sure beats the alternative suggestions of “ship them to Liberia” or “make them 2nd class citizens ala Jim Crow.” If you’re worried that they’re gonna pound on the doors to get in, that won’t happen as long as it’s clear to them that the new White-controlled nation states have nothing to offer them. Jeppo has lost his shit on the Russia-Ukraine debate, but he’s right about one thing: Non-whites ain’t pounding on the door to get into Poland, Estonia, etc.

    “Would a White ethnostate really alienate its own coastline and allow it to become a geopolitical playground for foreign intrigue to satisfy a universal abstract argument?”

    The coastline is only important if economics is your main consideration, and if that’s the case than I’d say the ethnostate is already off to a bad start. Even then, the economic importance of the coastline is overblown because most of the domestic energy production comes from North Dakota and Texas. And if fossil fuels aren’t your thing, you still don’t need a coastline to develop wind and solar power.

    “Are there any coastal cities in the United States which lack a large non-White population? Seattle is 66.3 percent White. San Francisco is 48 percent White. Los Angeles is 28.7 percent White. Are White Nationalists just going to give up those cities?”

    Why not? What’s so important about maintaining land that was colonized by previous generations of greedy, delusional, gold-seeking Yankees? Why do you think most whites in California, Oregon, and Washington have always had the same ideology and political culture as the Northeast? There’s really no argument for maintaining control of those cities unless you abide by the mantra that because our race once controlled those cities, we should do so again. Should we also recolonize Africa? What about India?

  43. An antagonistic relationship with Russia is bad for white demographics. As the last century proves.

  44. jmf, on March 9, 2014 at 4:14 pm:

    But what about the Mad Jewess? (If you are not familiar with it, go have a look.)… Then there is Jew Among You

    Thank you jmf — these seem to be interesting and worth watching. Two other Jews’ blogs to praise:

    Lawrence Auster: http://www.vdare.com/posts/the-passing-of-lawrence-auster-and-the-continued-existence-of-view-from-the-right

    Sultan Knish: http://www.vdare.com/posts/fine-daniel-greenfield-sultan-knish-amnesty-denunciation-at-frontpage

    In other words, having some nuance in your attitudes will make you more attractive to the kind of support that you need and less vulnerable to attack.

    Exactly!

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